Cayman 718 GPF Failure

[Scrounger]

Dave

Given that you now have all the information and evidence you need and that you have presented this, or tried to, to Porsche GB I feel the next step is 2 fold;

1. Contact Porsche Technical in Stuttgart directly giving your evidence and informing them that Porsche GB were not responsive in any respect.

2. Go to the motoring press. Porsche GB will be forced to either speak to you or admit there has been an issue for some time.

It’s time to force their hand and make them sit up and take notice. No matter how much work you put in trying to get hold of Porsche GB Technical it’s obvious they aren’t interested.

Dan.

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Dan,

You must have been reading my mind, I sent out an email yesterday to Stuttgart for the attention of their Technical Department detailing our frustrations, see below.

We are also looking into the possibility of taking action against Dealers who have, and are continuing to diagnose this fault wrongly.

We have further detailed information that confirms that these filters are not blocked with Ash when the P242F code presents on the dashboard.

This Porsche information is further evidence that the repair strategy to fit these filters is flawed.

If the adaptation reset using none Porsche diagnostic equipment on several vehicles is successful and it holds a zero, we will send this information to Porsche Reading for their comments.

Hopefully with all the information we have, Porsche will have no excuse for not sorting out this issue.

Its always been our aim to try and convince Porsche Reading Technical to push this problem on to the people that can make the desision to look at the software.

And more importantly we want our owners to stay in these cars, theres nothing in the market that can compete with the handling, performance, and overall driving experience these cars can give us, we shouldn't have to be going to these lengths to convince our Dealers that correct diagnosis of this fault is all we need and expect.

They have fitted all the hardware they could on Paul's car and it made no difference to the Ash%, coming back.

My Email to Stuttgart:

I have been working for the last 3 years in conjunction with the Porsche Club GB Forum regarding issues with GPF filters blocking up prematurely on 2019 Cayman and Boxster 718 vehicles, 2.0 and 2.5.

The dealers have been asking their customers to pay around 9K, for replacing a OPF filter thats shown to be 100% blocked with ash.

Over the last 3 years, we have managed to get the OPF information on these cars and found that none of the emission control information made any sense at all.

This enabled us to challenge Porsche through their dealers, and they have fitted 14 of these new modified parts at their cost.

I have dealt with other 40 people, but unfortunatly most of them sold their cars because of this fault.

I managed to get hold of an internal memo sent from Porsche to their Dealers, in March last year, which confirmed they had this issue in the first year of production in 2019. The memo confirmed that they brought out a modified OPF filter which would fix this issue.

These modified filters have been fitted to 13 vehicles, and the ash % has come back, which confirms that these filters are not the cause of this fault.

There is a EU Regulation no 2017/1151 which covers the emission control of motor vehicles with particulate filters fitted.

I believe that the fact that this emission control fault was present on the 2019 cars, in the first year of production, that this would come under a manufacturing defect issue, and the manufacturer would be responsible for this fault.

This situation doesn't seem right, bearing in mind its connected to the emisions on the vehicle. It's clear that this is an issue with the emission control system on these cars. The software is telling the engine management system that the GPF filter is full of ash when it isn't.

It puts the engine light on, which if the car was in for an MOT, it would certainly fail.

I am not suggesting in any way that this is affecting the tail pipe emissions because no soot has ever been seen on any of the cars we have dealt with. The OPF tailpipe colour is correct and was working correctly on all the cars we have dealt with, dealing with the soot.

Yet these OPF filters are being removed, WHY

have a data base on all the vehicle's involved and further information on our Porsche GB Club and other 718 forums.

If you go onto the Porsche GB Club forum, you don't need to be a member and Search, Cayman 718 GPF issues. You can view 47 pages of information concerning this problem.

At the moment we have 154,000 views on this subject the highest views ever seen in the Porsche GB Clubs history.

We desperately need your help, our owners are getting rid of these vehicles because of the cost of this repair, this is a clear case of miss diagnosis and we should not be in this position.

These cars are brilliant, there is nothing out there that can compete with the handling, performance and overall build quality on these cars.

These cars are going out of the Porsche network and ending up in the trade, which is absolutely ridiculous, could you please contact me, you can ring me anytime.


My phone number is 07769 590119

Kind regards

David Hitch



Fingers crossed
Dave

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Dan,

Me again Porsche Stuttgart have just confirmed they have my email, and they will be in touch soon.

Dave

 

[911hillclimber]

That is a good reply as you can now chase if the response is too slow.
IMHO 1 week is long enough.
Your persistence will pay off!

 

[Scrounger]

Great news Dave and I have to agree with 911HC, a week should be long enough for them to call the dealerships in the UK and gather their information to compose a reply to you.

Dan

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Thanks Guys

Hopefully they will contact us, this is their reply.

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Guys & Girls

Following on from our last post, regarding the ash load % adaptation possibility, here's a quick update on what we have been doing so far.

We have managed to carry out an adaptation on three vehicles, and change the ash load % to zero, without having to do a static regeneration.

When we carried out these adaptations, the soot warning light came on with DTC P2463 (Particulate filter soot load to high) showing very high values in both the measured and calculated values.

Remember we never see soot warning messages displayed on the dashboards on these cars, even when the filter is supposedly blocked with Ash.

So these cars came in with the ash load % light on, with the DTC code P242F present and showing a 100% ash load value. And has usual, the measured and calculated soot values showing 0.00%, (no soot present).

And also the differential pressure sensor readings were showing no pressure at all which is always the case.

So when the ash% value was changed to 0.00% the soot values appeared, which is crazy when they weren't there before, how can soot just come from nowhere ?.

So on the first 2 cars a static soot regeneration was carried out, the soot values dropped the light went out, and the cars were given back to their owners for us to monitor the ash % going forward.

Regarding our 3rd car, we are going to carry out road testing to see if passive soot regeneration will lower the soot values which should put out the warning light.
Will keep you informed of its progress.

The reason we are posting this information early is, we don't want owners to sell their cars because of this issue, when we may be able to provide a fix.

We just need to do more testing to see if the ash% returns, on the cars that we have done, and work out what diagnostic testers can do this adaptation.

The fact that a GPF ash load adaptation can be done before a static regeneration is a game changer, if you remember the Porsche internal memo says if the ash load level doesn't re set when the OPF regeneration is attempted, then the OPF should be replaced and the vehicle retested.

We know from the data collected from our cars that had new modified filters fitted, the ash % didn't stay at zero for long, and we are monitoring many of those cars at the moment.

So we continue on

Dave

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Guys & Girls

Some more information following on from my last post regarding the 3rd car.

The ash measured % level was at 99.61%, with a differential pressure sensor reading of 0.54 hPa, (no pressure) has now been reset to zero.

High Soot values appeared straight away in the measured and calculated readings.

Where did the soot come from, it wasn't there before we did the ash adaptation.

After driving the car for quite a few miles, the cars calculated soot value of 83% came down to zero, and the measured soot value of 52% reduced to 43.9%.

The soot warning light is still on, we are going to do a few more miles to see if it goes off by itself.

If it doesn't we will clear the soot code P2463 and see what happens.

Its really funny that it seems that the measured values of the ash and the soot, are the ones that bring on the warning lights and DTC codes P242F and P2463.

You would expect the calculated readings to be the ones that trigger the fault codes, not the measured.

Regarding the diagnostic tester that have been used to carry out these adaptations we have the following

Autel
Auto logic
Launch
VCDS version 25.3

We will be getting a model number for these testers has we go along, because there are different versions.

Iam arranging to get one of our faulty cars to go into a friend's garage locally, (Knaresborough near Harrogate to carry out the GPF adaptation and provide video information of how the adaptation takes place and show the results before and after.

I was speaking to one of our owners yesterday up north, that had a new modified filter fitted, paid for by Porsche, and the car went out of the their workshop with over 50% of ash still in the system.

This is because at the moment their PWIS tester does not have the adaptation of the GPF and the differential pressure sensor written in to its function menu, they are struggling to reset the ash % correctly in the ECU.

Makes you think if they would have had this function way back in 2019, they wouldn't have needed to bring out the modified GPF, that clearly doesn't fix this Ash issue.

We will push on

Dave

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Guys & Girls

I thought it was time to reflect on whats been going on with our GPF fault, and look backwards to when it all started on our forum.

Page 1, May 29th 2023
Mark reported an issue with his GPF to his local Porsche Dealer who informed him that he would have to pay for a new filter because he wasn't driving it correctly.

Page 5, October the 4th, we got involved thinking it was a failed AOS that was causing the oil ash issue.

Page 6, March 30th 2024, we put out a reward of £50.00 to anybody that could send us a dashboard photo of the soot warning light coming on.

Page 7, we increased the reward to £100.00, we also sent out AOS testers to some of our owners with the GPF fault to the check the readings, they all checked out ok.

We never had to pay out the reward money, so we cancelled it.

We rightly believed that a failing AOS was causing the GPF to fill up with Ash, has 90% of ash is caused by burnt engine oil.

We were very wrong to think this way.

Page 9, July 27th 2024 Paul came along with his Boxster 2.5 GTS with the GPF issue, and off we went on another journey.

After months and months in his local Porsche Dealership they replaced all these parts in an attempt to reset the ash % level on his car.

These are the parts replaced below.

2 GPF filters, one new one, and one exchange
AOS
2 differential pressure sensors
DME
Engine removed stripped down looking for signs of internal consumption, none found.
One brand new exchange engine
And finally one new turbo

Unfortunately the ash % didn't go to zero.

Paul changed his car because his Porsche Dealer with all their resources couldn't fix this problem.

So along came the internal memo from Porsche to their Dealers March last year that instructed their Technicians to check for internal oil consumption issues, and checks on the AOS, turbo and the functionality of the OPF differential pressure sensor to make sure everything was ok.

And if everything was ok, then to carry out a regeneration and if the ash % did not reset, they had to replace the filter with a modified part.

Durring our journey we have had 14 of our cars fitted with these modified GPF filters, and 13 of these cars have come back with ash levels way above what they should be.

Thank goodness that Porsche paid for these filters.

We have posted out our concerns that the back pressure check was not mentioned in the internal memo.

Because if it had been, the Dealers would have found no back pressure present which would confirm the none existent differential pressure sensor reading was actually correct.

So a further 39 pages on our forum have been created in hope that Porsche will see that something more needs to be done to fix these cars.

We have given lots and lots of Technical information that clearly shows the this fault has been miss diagnosed from day one.

So to bring us up todate, we are looking at the ash % adaptation of these filters and if we have to create more pages of technical information we will.

Sorry to go on, its been quite a journey, but we are hopefully near to its end.

Fingers crossed

Dave

 

[911hillclimber]

Like a dog with a bone!
Excellent, we are all behind you and I do not have this problem!
I am disappointed in the way Porsche UK and Porsche Germany have/are performing on this, I personally expected a lot lot better.

It make me appreciate my 2009 987.2 Boxster even more.

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Dan
Could you ring me on 07769 590119 I have some important information for you.

Dave

 

[Cyclemotor1958]

Hi Guys & Girls

Some good news, Ive just heard from my chap that had the GPF adaptation and he was testing the car to see if the soot warning light would go out on its own, well it has.

To recap, the GPF was adapted to zero, and immediately the soot values appeared on the screen and the soot warning DTC P2463 was present.

They checked the soot values, and found the following,
K211 soot load calculated was at 83%
K221 soot load measured was at 52%

Remember before the adaptation both soot values were zero and the GPF had not been regenerated.

They carried on driving the car and they checked again, the chap has his own tester, and found the K211 calculated figure was now at zero, but the K221 measured value had gone down to 50%, the light was still on at this point.

A bit more miles, total covered 300 miles, the soot warning light has gone out, the K221 measured value is the same and the best news the K231 oil ash load measured value is STILL ZERO.

This just shows that there is no reason to do a regeneration on these cars when no soot values are recorded when the ash level is at 100%.

When the Dealers follow the memo instructions and carry the regeneration the ash sometimes resets to zero but then comes back if its rechecked again.

So if it doesn't reset they fit a very expensive GPF that doesn't need replacing, and we can prove this because we have all the data of 13 cars that had the modified filters changed and the ash came back very quickly.

We will keep checking this cars ash value, but it looks very promising.

Ive spoken to another one of our 718 owners today who's been told he needs a new GPF filter, obviously I told him not to pay for one, and definitely not sell his car.

Will update you on his progress has we go along.

We will keep pushing, but this is fantastic news

Dave

 

[Wrightrubber]

Hi Dave
That's excellent news and a big step forward to solving this issue, it's amazing how you have got this far when Porsche were unable to do anything about it, except charge customers extortionate amount of money!!
Keep going!!!!
Regards
Mark