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Design Flaws

zcacogp

Active member
Guys,

I love 944's. You love 944's. We all love 944's, which is why we use this forum! [:)]

But, brilliant as they may be, they aren't perfect. In fact, they are far from it. Having owned my S2 for the thick end of 7 years now, I have come to realise it is littered with design flaws. Three that come to mind immediately are as follows;

- Brake Calipers, with metals with different electropotentials in close contact with each other in a wet environment. Corrosion is inevitable, and someone should have spotted this before the calipers were put into production. Yes, I know the stainless steel plate is there for a reason but a better solution for restraining the pads could have been thought up - brake pad pins, as on the teves calipers for instance.

- Rubber spoiler on the rear hatch, and those piddly little 10mmx4mm holes that they are meant to drain through. Yes, those holes that get blocked if the car ever ventures within six miles of a tree, causing something akin to lake windermere to develop on the rear spoiler when it rains, which means water runs into the boot when you open the boot lid. I can understand that bigger holes would detract from the aerodynamic efficiency of the spoiler by bleeding air from a high pressure area to a low pressure area, but someone must have spotted this before it went into production, surely?

- The minor controls in the interior. A pet bugbear of mine, but really - it's a mess! There is no way of looking at a switch and knowing how to operate it. Some rock (rear wiper, fog lights), some press in and latch (air recirc), some roll (headlight levelling), some twist (headlights. And, now we've mentioned it, that headlight control knob is damned ugly and far bigger than any other control on the dashboard apart from the steering wheel. Why is it so ... huge?) Were the different bits of the dashboard designed by different teams who had different design philosophies, different temperaments and different numbers of fingers? Why so inconsistent? And while we're talking about minor switchgear, why is it so poorly illuminated? The switches in front of the gearlever are bathed in rich black darkness at night, and an inexperienced owner has to learn which one does what (as well as whether any one switch he is presented with needs to be prodded, flicked or twisted.)

There must be more - there ARE more, but I can't be bothered to type them out as I am a lazy git! Someone help me ... what design flaws have you come across on the 944 (and what can be done to rectify them)? I shall award a prize to the person who comes up with the longest list ...


Oli.
 
Those without a turbo....

Minor switches lack of illumination is a pain. I'd like an intermittent rear wiper.
Handbrake position but only because its different and invariably which car I'm in I reach for the wrong side.
 
I've said this before, but the whole business with the hatch pins and the completely Heath Robinson, and very heavy, electric hatch release mechanism is utterly strange.

Why they couldn't they have done it with a key that opens a straightforward mechanical latch? Instead we have a key that activates a switch that powers a motor that turns a crank that pulls on some cables that release some jaws that let the pins go.
 

ORIGINAL: DavidL
Handbrake position but only because its different and invariably which car I'm in I reach for the wrong side.

And also because it is VERY easy to release it accidentally with your foot while getting in and out. Which is not good when you are parked on a slope.
 
Another minor one is the trip meter reset button being designed so that it explodes the mechanism if you use it on the move.
 
Interesting. I have always thought the handbrake placement was an advantage - you can release the handbrake while putting the car into gear, which is useful when doing hill starts.

There is a tiny bit of logic in the rear boot catch design in that it has two catches, whereas most cars only have one. (I presume this is to prevent too much flexing of the glass in the tailgate.) Having said that, they could very easily have had a system such as you described Simon but with a link to both catches.


ORIGINAL: DavidL

Those without a turbo....
Those with a turbo ...


Oli.
 

ORIGINAL: Lowtimer

I've said this before, but the whole business with the hatch pins and the completely Heath Robinson, and very heavy, electric hatch release mechanism is utterly strange.

Why they couldn't they have done it with a key that opens a straightforward mechanical latch? Instead we have a key that activates a switch that powers a motor that turns a crank that pulls on some cables that release some jaws that let the pins go.

Most 944s do have a mechanical lock, but Porsche 'improved' it for the 1989 model year.
 
Oli,

The switchgear horrors are still there in the 993 in 1998. I always forget which is forward spots and which is rear fog.

Porsche got things better in the 996 & 997 but then ruined all by putting water in the engines.

BTW I use a Windows 7 laptop..... [:)]

Gerry
 
...and there are those engines with twice as many valves and camshafts as they really need, with some bit of old bike chain attempting to connect the lot together.
 
We know the drain holes get blocked; try not opening it so bloody qiuickly and letting the water drain off WITHOUT it going into the boot. Porsche cannot be blamed for the calipers; Brembo make the most highly regarded brakes and I believe that the four pot calipers are of brembo manufacture. Switches are usually differently shaped so that you can identify them by feel, and it is a bit of a myth that the trip reset shatters the mechanism, probably a hangover from the models with the 924 style dash where indeed operating the trip whilst on the move did crack the trip drive pinion, in my O pinion. (sic)
You might as well say why are alll aircraft not not desgined with the same cockpit.
 
ORIGINAL: 924nutter

... try not opening it so bloody qiuickly and letting the water drain off WITHOUT it going into the boot.

Well that's me told!

>OffToTheNaughtyStepForOpeningMyBootTooBloodyQuickly< [:(]


Oli.
 
Oh this is one where I will play devil's advocate with relish!!!

OK, so all these minor niggles... would you rather the alternative? The controls - all different shapes, positions, and "feel". That I understand is on purpose so you can find the controls in the dark... perhaps the biggest of those needs to be the light-switch! In fact, where the switches are all similar - the row of four in front of the gear-lever (or behind if it is an early dash car), are a pain because you have to find one, ensure it is the last one, and then count across by feel. Yes, you could illuminate them, but I would rather keep my eyes on the road, and them have a more distinctive "feel".

Callipers... weren't manufactured by Porsche, but... think about what the car was manufactured for - to last forever, or to provide a given performance, at a cost? So... make them out of solid stainless steel, or keep the unsprung weight down, use stainless where it is needed, and accept they will have a finite life and the car be affordable?

The boot spoiler and rain running in (which runs in just off the volume of glass, even if the drain holes aren't blocked... I'm not sure what the effects of the necessary changes might be, but do we know this wasn't looked at, and accepted rather than need a major redesign or cause say, high-speed cross-wind instability?

The hatch-lock/motor vs key confounds me... maybe it was down to "customer expectation" in terms of gadgets and gizmos that sell the car. One thing I have noticed is that in terms of engineering, there are some real gems - I absolutely adore the simplistic beauty of the belt guard/guide in the belt case... and the block has obviously had a lot of thought given to it in terms of even cooling, oil flow etc etc, yet the guard over the front of the fly-wheel looks like the apprentice designed it... probably because he did! The design effort has gone into the bits that count... what do you want, a 150mph motor car, or something which goes whizz-bang the moment it reaches 35mph, but at least you can look at the beautiful switches whilst waiting for the RAC man![:D]

Just to re-affirm, I am playing devil's advocate, and there is nothing wrong (and everything right) with critical appraisal, but we only get to see the biggest problems remaining, because the really big problems have been engineered out, possibly leaving the things which niggle us to avoid something far, far worse.

Oh, and don't forget the upside down oil filter!
 
ORIGINAL: Veerzigzag

...and there are those engines with twice as many valves and camshafts as they really need, with some bit of old bike chain attempting to connect the lot together.

Sorry, meant to attach this to my post!!
 
Guys the design is probably 25+ years old. Compare the 944 to cars of a similar time (if you can find any) and it becomes apparent how good the design really was. We all fall into the trap of comparing the 944 to modern cars and it isn't really fair. I would have to suggest there is no car of a similar age that seems as contemporary as the 944.

A agree there are idiosyncrasies but the switch location, notation and operation is probably a lot better, than most 25 year old cars. If you look in an Aston Martin of similar vintage it seems to have switchgear which wouldn't look out of place on Thunderbirds.
 
major flaw,


....rear end grip at 6mph



.........when trail braking past your keyboard


...........[;)]



no, that'l be non N rated tyres[8|]



 
As a whole they are so great that we can lament only on insignificant details.

When the wave of torque kicks in at 4k and the rear end start having a life of its own at funny speeds but still lets you in control to make a beautifully controlled slide in a thunder of roar and turbo whistle I forgive her everything.
 

ORIGINAL: tref

The boot spoiler and rain running in (which runs in just off the volume of glass, even if the drain holes aren't blocked... I'm not sure what the effects of the necessary changes might be, but do we know this wasn't looked at, and accepted rather than need a major redesign or cause say, high-speed cross-wind instability?

We do know that they eventually ditched it in favour of the bridge spoiler, and I'm very happy having one of those.
 

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