Could the 718 replacement be an EV?
- Thread starter Motorhead
- Start date
I think it's going to be interesting to see where the sales demand is going to come from for the EV Cayman. I'm not sure that many of us older generation will swap flat six models for one while we can still run them, so will Porsche need to attract newcomers to the brand instead? Younger folks who are EV keen? Porsche hasn't historically fared well appealing to younger people though, at least from what I've seen.
I assume the price is going to be e-Macan similar, so a hell of a lot of money. The Cayman has historically been a great value sports car, but an EV version at £80k+? It's a very different target audience that they'll need and I'm not sure it's large enough to support the model. How many 30(?) year olds have that kind of money to spend on a car, or can afford the non-government-subsidised finance rates?
Maybe I'm just being a dinosaur, but time will tell I guess...
I assume the price is going to be e-Macan similar, so a hell of a lot of money. The Cayman has historically been a great value sports car, but an EV version at £80k+? It's a very different target audience that they'll need and I'm not sure it's large enough to support the model. How many 30(?) year olds have that kind of money to spend on a car, or can afford the non-government-subsidised finance rates?
Maybe I'm just being a dinosaur, but time will tell I guess...
Broadly, I’m of the same mind Dave. However I was reading that Gen Z [currently 13-28 year-olds] are projected to be the wealthiest generation by 2035, in part owing to wealth transfer from the post-WW2 Baby Boomers, so they should have adequate disposable income to purchase an EV sports car should they wish.
There were some interesting comments on the PH piece. A European contributor pointed out that in some EU countries the VED equivalent for an ICE vehicle is eye-watering and another reckoned that Audi are running prototypes with a view to platform sharing for a TT, although I was under the impression that it will use the VAG Scalable Systems Platform.
Inevitably the new Cayman will be bigger and heavier than the 718 [which dates back to 2012], not only owing to the battery, but it’s going to be very quick up to the legal speed limits, probably with a top speed around 250kph [~150mph] and hopefully with a useful range in excess of 300 miles. With the Taycan Porsche have shown that they can make a sporting EV handle well, so that shouldn’t be an issue. Hopefully we’ll be finding out later this year.
Jeff
There were some interesting comments on the PH piece. A European contributor pointed out that in some EU countries the VED equivalent for an ICE vehicle is eye-watering and another reckoned that Audi are running prototypes with a view to platform sharing for a TT, although I was under the impression that it will use the VAG Scalable Systems Platform.
Inevitably the new Cayman will be bigger and heavier than the 718 [which dates back to 2012], not only owing to the battery, but it’s going to be very quick up to the legal speed limits, probably with a top speed around 250kph [~150mph] and hopefully with a useful range in excess of 300 miles. With the Taycan Porsche have shown that they can make a sporting EV handle well, so that shouldn’t be an issue. Hopefully we’ll be finding out later this year.
Jeff
I for one won't be swapping my 6 banger for an EV. Not that I'm averse to change but It's not for me. I'm sure it'll be a cracking car but I'm sceptical on the battery range and price.
Personally I think the base model will start at c. £80k as Dave mentioned above. Top spec models will most likely be almost £100k and then you're into 911 money.
Dan
Personally I think the base model will start at c. £80k as Dave mentioned above. Top spec models will most likely be almost £100k and then you're into 911 money.
Dan
I’m not so sure that the starting price will be that high Dan. The current 718 base and S Caymans start at about £54k and £64k respectively, so I would imagine that the base car will retail at less than £60k. However, like the Taycan depreciation is going to be the bigger question, especially since these cars are more likely to be private rather than business purchases.
Jeff
PS: Just to note that Porsche journos and enthusiasts were berating the company for introducing the F4-T engine … but they still sell!
Jeff
PS: Just to note that Porsche journos and enthusiasts were berating the company for introducing the F4-T engine … but they still sell!
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I can't see them coming in much cheaper than the Macan, Jeff. Less than £60k is going to be a real challenge with the cost of materials these days, plus it will need to be priced as a premium product given the badge for marketing purposes.
I'm not convinced Gen Z are going to be that wealthy within the next 10 years. Surely it's Gen X, the children of the Boomers, not the grandchildren. Plus I can't see large numbers of Gen Z's dropping £100k on an electric 2-seater sports car, most of them don't even like cars!
I'm not convinced Gen Z are going to be that wealthy within the next 10 years. Surely it's Gen X, the children of the Boomers, not the grandchildren. Plus I can't see large numbers of Gen Z's dropping £100k on an electric 2-seater sports car, most of them don't even like cars!
Yes, I too would have thought that Gen X would have the inherited wealth Dave, but reputable online sources say that it’s going to be Gen Z who will benefit most. Who knows?
I suppose that the 718 has benefited from the platform’s long life in keeping its price low, so as you say the new car is likely to have a significant price hike. However I can’t see the price of a base Cayman jumping from £54K to around £80k, but we’ll have to see what turns up.
Jeff
I suppose that the 718 has benefited from the platform’s long life in keeping its price low, so as you say the new car is likely to have a significant price hike. However I can’t see the price of a base Cayman jumping from £54K to around £80k, but we’ll have to see what turns up.
Jeff
I agree Jeff, camo all round on the lower body but the rear quarter windows also look like they have a cover over them that displays a shape which is more 911 style than traditional Cayman so maybe something radical is happening there too.
Thanks Dan. I clearly misremembered the launch price of the EV!
I didn't know that a base 718 was currently £53k. Wow. They've really gone up. I thought they started with a "3"!!!!!
I’ve just seen this piece in Autocar suggesting that the “top” versions of the next-generation 718 Boxster and Cayman [RS & GT4 RS maybe?] will include an ICE option. Short on detail, and more of a footnote to more drastic changes in Porsche’s strategy moving forward, with less emphasis on EVs.
www.autocar.co.uk
Jeff
The petrol Porsche Boxster is coming BACK after all! | Autocar
New petrol 718 variants inbound alongside EV; upcoming 'K1' luxury SUV swaps from EV to ICE power
www.autocar.co.uk
Jeff
Adopting that route would be a significant challenge from the packaging standpoint with the mid-engine layout Dan, the intercooling especially if you think of the complex air-to-coolant arrangement in the F-4T cars, and that’s with a more compact engine for starters. Then you’ve got to find space for the inverter, DC-DC converter, power electronics and battery cooling; and that’s before re-engineering the 718’s ZF PDK transmission to accept the electric motor unless the 992.2’s unit can be adapted. I can’t see that the significant development costs involved could be justified unless Porsche foresees a big demand for these “top” versions which will have to be at 992 prices.
On the other hand a mild hybridisation of the 4.0L F-6 [or even the 2.5L F-4T!] would be relatively straightforward and easily achievable at minimal cost.
Having said all that, the starting point will be the new EV platform which will be bigger and will already have all the electronic gubbins in place and which presumably has the potential to be adapted for a plug-in hybrid arrangement [using an electric motor in a PDK transmission?], so anything’s possible.
Jeff
On the other hand a mild hybridisation of the 4.0L F-6 [or even the 2.5L F-4T!] would be relatively straightforward and easily achievable at minimal cost.
Having said all that, the starting point will be the new EV platform which will be bigger and will already have all the electronic gubbins in place and which presumably has the potential to be adapted for a plug-in hybrid arrangement [using an electric motor in a PDK transmission?], so anything’s possible.
Jeff
You're probably right Jeff and I agree with the cost but the way that Porsche are pricing at the minute it appears they are just plucking numbers out of the air and expecting folk to buy them. Who knows what their new BEV platform is capable of right now, only time will tell I suppose.
Dan
Dan
Agreed Dan. The base 718 Cayman retailed at a very reasonable price of £53,800 but the 718 GT4 RS was priced at a somewhat eye-watering £125,500 - and that’s before expensive options! - so it’ll be interesting to see what the market will accept for any future ICE offering assuming the EV probably will be retailing at more than £70k, as already discussed.
Whatever, it seems that we’ve still got a long wait to find out.
Jeff
Whatever, it seems that we’ve still got a long wait to find out.
Jeff
Well, contrary to what I was saying about the difficulty of using the T-Hybrid setup used in the 992.2 GTS it seems as though that’s precisely what Porsche are contemplating for these top-of-the-range models if this piece is to be believed, its shorter length being crucial for packaging the mid-engine layout:
www.autocar.co.uk
Jeff
Porsche might put the 911's flat six into its new Cayman and Boxster | Autocar
German firm confirms "top" versions of 718s will continue in EV strategy pivot
www.autocar.co.uk
Jeff
“Might” and “could” are doing some heavy lifting.
How would this be different from a 911?
How would this be different from a 911?
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