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Helpful ReplyHot!718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.!

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BJ Innes
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 15:11:45 (permalink)
ralphmusic
The 981 GT4 has torque limiting, as do the Base, S and GTS 718 and 981 series versions




Torque limiting in 1st gear only applies to the manual gearbox. This is supposedly to protect the dual mass clutch mechanism. The 718 GTS PDK has no such torque limiting impediment in 1st gear. Which probably explains why the 2.5 718 GTS PDK out accelerates the 4.0 982 GT4.
 
It would be an interesting read if Autocar magazine would do a full forensic road test comparison between the 2019 718 GTS PDK and the 2019 982 GT4 manual.
The 718 GTS magazine road tests I am aware of have all featured the 6-speed manual version with the torque limiting software in 1st gear.
 
 
Brian
           

Nairnshire,
Highlands
Previous:
2007 Cayman 987.1 2.7 Manual.
2010 Cayman S 987.2 Manual
2012 Cayman R Manual
2019 718 Cayman S PDK
Current:
2015 Abarth 595 Competizione 180bhp Manual
718 Cayman GTS PDK

Twinfan
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 15:21:36 (permalink)
I think MrDemon is referring to the limiting of maximum torque of the engine due to the limits of the manual gearbox.  This seems to apply to the 981 GT4, the 718 S, the 718 GTS and the 718 GT4.  They all have the same maximum torque rating of 420Nm.
MrDemon
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 16:18:11 (permalink)
 
Twinfan
I think MrDemon is referring to the limiting of maximum torque of the engine due to the limits of the manual gearbox.  This seems to apply to the 981 GT4, the 718 S, the 718 GTS and the 718 GT4.  They all have the same maximum torque rating of 420Nm.




Correct , they gave  us a 4.0l which means more torque on the table, but then did not let us have it. On the 981 I doubt we lost much, on a 4.0 we are maybe 30lb/ft down on what it could give out Which is a real shame eps out the bends, the gearing takes away 40bhp at the wheels and we are 30lb/ft down over saving £4K on some cogs ! 
 
Just think how good it could have been, for a very small extra outlay. 
 
Its killed the o-124mph time now vs a GT3 by massive margins, (3.5 seconds slower ) . And only a second faster than the old GT4. And still slower than my 991.1 GTS I just sold. 
post edited by MrDemon - 2019/07/19 16:24:14

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Twinfan
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 16:22:56 (permalink)
I agree it's a real waste, but ultimately part of the Cayman vs 911 positioning hierarchy.  It is what it is.
MrDemon
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 16:30:46 (permalink)
Twinfan
I agree it's a real waste, but ultimately part of the Cayman vs 911 positioning hierarchy.  It is what it is.




but it's an expensive car now.  the last one was cheap and thus you could forgive it due to that.
 
It's gone up 10k, and you cannot access the power of the new engine !  

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Twinfan
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 16:32:43 (permalink)
You have two choices I think  
Motorhead
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 17:17:58 (permalink)
Yup, no point bleating about it D - it's a done deal, and like the rest of us you can choose to vote with your feet. There are too many things in life that in retrospect would have been much better done differently, so best just to move on.
 
BJ Innes
 
Torque limiting in 1st gear only applies to the manual gearbox. This is supposedly to protect the dual mass clutch mechanism. The 718 GTS PDK has no such torque limiting impediment in 1st gear. Which probably explains why the 2.5 718 GTS PDK out accelerates the 4.0 982 GT4.
 
It would be an interesting read if Autocar magazine would do a full forensic road test comparison between the 2019 718 GTS PDK and the 2019 982 GT4 manual.
The 718 GTS magazine road tests I am aware of have all featured the 6-speed manual version with the torque limiting software in 1st gear.
 
Brian
          



Brian,
 
Although there may well be an element of DME torque limitation, the 981 GT4's clutch slave cylinder is fitted with a mechanical peak torque limiter in order to reduce the peak torque supplied to the transmission in cases of misuse (e.g. side-stepping the clutch). I assume that's been carried-over to the 982 GT4.
 
Jeff
 
 

987.2 Cayman S
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BJ Innes
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 17:40:51 (permalink)
Thanks for the clarification on that David and Jeff.
 
Methinks a PDK 982 GT4 will not be too far off. Such a move would also correct the absurd situation with standing start acceleration times, and return the GT4 to its rightful place in the acceleration hierarchy within the Cayman model range.
 
Brian      
 

Nairnshire,
Highlands
Previous:
2007 Cayman 987.1 2.7 Manual.
2010 Cayman S 987.2 Manual
2012 Cayman R Manual
2019 718 Cayman S PDK
Current:
2015 Abarth 595 Competizione 180bhp Manual
718 Cayman GTS PDK

MrDemon
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/19 20:13:00 (permalink)
I did vote with my feet, I bought a GT3 and last week bought another brand with 500real bhp and 600nm torques :-)
 
i also bought the 991.1 GTS in the interim With the right engine :-) 
 
i dont get the bun fight over these new cars And people moaning they cannot get one, when you can buy better cars cheaper ! 

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Motorhead
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/20 13:27:09 (permalink)
Good on you D. Care to share your choice - a McLaren maybe?
 
If you're not fussy about buying used there's plenty of choice out there, and better value too. The 982 GT4's certainly not the bargain its predecessor was, but Porsche have had the benefit of experience having miscalculated significantly the potential demand for the 981 GT4, in particular from 918 and GT Porsche owners. Compared with 2015 Sterling has slipped significantly against the Euro (~ 1.3/1.4 almost to parity), which accounts for much of the price hike.
 
There's always a bun fight when a new car is announced, and logic rarely comes into the equation for many purchasers. If you're in the market for a GT4, logic tells you that it's much more sensible to sit tight until deliveries begin and then pick up a well-spec'd and reasonably low mileage 981 GT4 when their (currently) inflated prices start to slip.
 
Jeff

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ralphmusic
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/20 17:00:47 (permalink)
Another review
 


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Motorhead
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/21 08:55:20 (permalink)
A decent appraisal, but just a video re-run of the two Prosser articles in PH, so nothing new there - blah, blah muffled sound; blah, blah long gearing. The gearing was an issue with the 981 so his only complaint really can be with the sound of the engine, more noticeable on the Spyder than the GT4 for obvious reasons.
 
I'm not an apologist for Porsche's decisions, but I think we've got the point and need to move on. If the 718-6 cars are announced before the end of this year - with less power and most likely with a PDK option - we'll have the opportunity to gauge whether or not the revised ratios of the PDK transmission address the gearing issue to some degree.
 
Jeff
 
 

987.2 Cayman S
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MrDemon
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/21 11:05:58 (permalink)
 
Motorhead
A decent appraisal, but just a video re-run of the two Prosser articles in PH, so nothing new there - blah, blah muffled sound; blah, blah long gearing. The gearing was an issue with the 981 so his only complaint really can be with the sound of the engine, more noticeable on the Spyder than the GT4 for obvious reasons.
 
I'm not an apologist for Porsche's decisions, but I think we've got the point and need to move on. If the 718-6 cars are announced before the end of this year - with less power and most likely with a PDK option - we'll have the opportunity to gauge whether or not the revised ratios of the PDK transmission address the gearing issue to some degree.
 
Jeff
 
 




 
I aways do real reviews, it’s about time the gearbox came under the hammer from Dan.
 
the focus on the last GT4 was the engine ! When really it was the gearbox, the engine was fine At the price point And more importantly was a very strong unit giving zero issues.
 
yes the x51 was a better GT4 fit, but the engine was  still fine. It was always the gearbox and again it’s the gearbox It just took 2nd place as people demanded a better engine. 
 
now it has a better engine, the gearbox now hits the reviews More so than ever as it does rule the car and how it drives. 
 
people should just listen to me 4 years ago when I said the gearbox was crap and ruined the car And I bought a R for fun to drive. :-) 
 
not posting about my new car, I am fed up of people willy waving new car slots and saying every thing is mega. 
 
I voted with my feet feet and just bought something Different, no badge snob, no overs, just a fun car to own. 
 
I sold my 991.1 GTS as the eps was a step to far for me, I hated it, but loved the engine.
so it lasted 3 months ! 
 
The question from the reviews about 718 GT4 steering is a worry also. 
 
i do wonder when they bring out the PDK GT4 if that will be the RS .

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Motorhead
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/21 13:44:39 (permalink)
Here's an oddity: although the Chrono Package is standard on the Spyder it's a £336 option on the supposedly track-focused GT4. Can anyone explain the logic of that?
 
Jeff

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Motorhead
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/22 10:45:44 (permalink)
Just a comment on the new car's weight, courtesy of CAR mag:
 
...there is some actual extra weight in the car (the diffuser* is about 6 or 7kg more, the new particulate filter around 11kg, and a bigger starter motor and a bigger battery are part and parcel of meeting the new emissions regulations)...
 
*Diffuser + Wing?
 
The 982 has stop/start (hence the meatier battery and starter motor). I'm sure that the non-GT 981-series cars have stop/start but can't recall if it was included on the GT4?
 
Jeff
 

987.2 Cayman S
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Twinfan
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/22 11:02:24 (permalink)
The 981 GT4 didn't have stop-stop.
ralphmusic
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/22 11:33:35 (permalink)
Twinfan
The 981 GT4 didn't have stop-stop.



 
But it had go go 

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Twinfan
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/22 11:35:09 (permalink)
Ha ha, sorry about that!
Motorhead
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/22 13:07:28 (permalink)
Stop-start, cylinder deactivation and GPFs: economy and both noise and emissions regulations have become major considerations even for a track-focused sports car.
 
Jeff

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ralphmusic
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Re: 718 Cayman GT4 is here – at long last.! 2019/07/23 11:54:28 (permalink)
Someone seems to like it, original in Swiss German.. read in Swinglish via Chrome translate - not sure what "punched you the cathedral camp from behind in the kidneys" means! However ...
 
http://radical-mag.com/2019/07/21/porsche-718-cayman-gt4/
 
 
 
 
post edited by ralphmusic - 2019/07/23 12:05:33

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