Who says 944 prices are down

[Fen]

ORIGINAL: appletonn
...that perhaps need a couple of grand spending on them?[]

Allowing for dealer margins too....

Point being here though that in the case of this car/dealer I have heard too many people say the cars still need money spending on them (which is my experience of buying 8 Porsches, some dealer, some private - dealer ones no better, often not as good as private cars owned by enthusiasts). Worse, by reputation this dealer isn't all that interested in making the car any better despite asking top dollar for it.

With the possible exception of RPM and probably 9xx when there are some cars ready to buy (dealers who actually specialise in these models), having been around the community for 14 years there is not one dealer in the UK that I would pay a premium to for a 944, because they don't make enough money out if them to put right any issues, they don't know them well enough to know what's wrong, they don't care about them, they don't value the business of buyers at that end of the Porsche market etc. etc.

 

[appletonn]

ORIGINAL: Fen

ORIGINAL: appletonn
...that perhaps need a couple of grand spending on them?[]

Allowing for dealer margins too....

Point being here though that in the case of this car/dealer I have heard too many people say the cars still need money spending on them (which is my experience of buying 8 Porsches, some dealer, some private - dealer ones no better, often not as good as private cars owned by enthusiasts). Worse, by reputation this dealer isn't all that interested in making the car any better despite asking top dollar for it.

With the possible exception of RPM and probably 9xx when there are some cars ready to buy (dealers who actually specialise in these models), having been around the community for 14 years there is not one dealer in the UK that I would pay a premium to for a 944, because they don't make enough money out if them to put right any issues, they don't know them well enough to know what's wrong, they don't care about them, they don't value the business of buyers at that end of the Porsche market etc. etc.

I would tend to agree, but would add 911virgin.com to that list, as Henry was excellent when i bought my old 964 from him and subsequently had a couple of issues with the car.

They did have a 944 S2 for sale a couple of weeks ago.

 

[Fen]

I thought about including Henry, but I didn't for the simple reason a lot of what I have seen from there is, how can I put this? "Honest". I personally probably wouldn't buy a 944 from him these days.

To be fair the 911 I bought from him (around 10 or 11 years ago now) was quite cheap and had nothing major wrong with it, and when it came time to get out of it he got me £250 more than we agreed he woulld on sale or return, but it was far from a nice example and the same could be said of the 944 Lux a mate had from him around the same time.

The downside is that he necessarily has to charge dealer money (though admittedly low dealer money) and the cars are not, in my experience, any better than private. For example he's very realistic about what 17 years of usage can reasonably have done to a car (a polite way of saying many cars are rough around the edges cosmetically) and he won't get the air-con working, so while I didn't have to get him to look at anything on the 911 I bought from him I suspect that a lot of stuff he'd consider to be expected. I believe if you bought a car from him and it put a leg out of bed on the way home he would sort you out, but I suspect a broken seat motor might not.

Dealers have to cover themselves and Porsche parts cost what Porsche parts cost so a very sick 944 S2 costs similar money to fix as a very sick 996, therefore the percentage margin on the 944 has to be higher or it simply isn't worth their while getting involved in the cheaper car. Looking at Henry's website just now I don't see any 944s to see how much he's looking for for an S2 these days, but what strikes me is that little on there is pre-993, which bears out my statement above - it's not really worth getting into the cheaper stuff because of the potentially margin-obliterating costs of standing by a wrong-un.

That holds true to the extent that I can't see there is a business in preparing 944s to the extent that RPM seem to have done and Jon was telling us he's going to do with the cars he currently has - I assume it's an exercise in building a name and corresponding reputation among the enthusiast community that will bring in service work that does make money.

 

[bigkeeko]

ORIGINAL: pauly


That was my opinion but a year + later I still haven't bought one

A year plus? [] I thought I was slow! Nah, pauly I`ll be bought and paid for in the next few weeks and probably will compromise ( as you really have to with old cars). Good luck anyway. []

 

[jr2015]

Hmm, interesting thread, Due to various circs my 1983 model has been on a SORN for a year , but am intending to ressurect it soon and was debating the economic sense of it as I`m expecting the clutch to be seized as I believe its the original and has 130,000 under its wheels . It also needs new discs and probably caliper overhaul. The bodywork is sound as is the interior apart from the cracked dash. With the proposed changes to road tax, as I understand them,classics won`t be hammered to the same extent as cars made after 2001, so it seems the economics may make sense to spend the time and cash.
With regards to the state of world economics ,we`re at the mercy of commodity speculators and the media who like nothing better than spreading panic, If you`re feeling down about the dropping value of property, draw a graph of your house price over the last 15 years and you`ll find the latest drop is relatively small compared the the overall gain.However if you`ve been borrowing against the inceased equity every year and adding it to the mortgage, you`ve probably learned not to do that again. When I bought my first house, Bank managers (remember them?) used to say no you can`t afford it ,which was a better approach than the advice the spotty kids who have run banks for the last ten years have been handing out as they`ve been blinded into thinking property only goes up and never down in value, hence the sub-prime debacle.
regards,
jr

 

[Big Dave]

Hey chaps.
For those of you that are on the hunt for a VERY VERY good 944S2 Check this one out......

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/624943.htm

As you can read, i have done a HUGE amount of work to this car. And its ready for one of you chaps to now use it and enhance it over the coming months + years...
Personally i dont think it is a expensive car , considdering the work that has been done to it...
Just work out how much it would cost NOW to do what i have done to this, ON top of buying a car in the first place....LOTS,,,££££££££££££.
So on that basis its a VERY cheap car...
Yes there are some cheap cars on the market, but what are they ACTUALLY like, as most of you know they are usually cheap for a reason....

Yes it is mine, as ive updated to a 968 "toy"...

 

[appletonn]

Dave, sounds like a bargain at that price and after all of the work done[]

Any pics?

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: Big Dave UK

Hey chaps.
For those of you that are on the hunt for a VERY VERY good 944S2 Check this one out......

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/624943.htm

As you can read, i have done a HUGE amount of work to this car. And its ready for one of you chaps to now use it and enhance it over the coming months + years...
Personally i dont think it is a expensive car , considdering the work that has been done to it...
Just work out how much it would cost NOW to do what i have done to this, ON top of buying a car in the first place....LOTS,,,££££££££££££.
So on that basis its a VERY cheap car...
Yes there are some cheap cars on the market, but what are they ACTUALLY like, as most of you know they are usually cheap for a reason....

Yes it is mine, as ive updated to a 968 "toy"...

Apart from the looks and the extra gear what has the 968 got this hasn't ?.

 

[Peter Empson]

ORIGINAL: Big Dave UK

Hey chaps.
For those of you that are on the hunt for a VERY VERY good 944S2 Check this one out......

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/624943.htm

As you can read, i have done a HUGE amount of work to this car. And its ready for one of you chaps to now use it and enhance it over the coming months + years...
Personally i dont think it is a expensive car , considdering the work that has been done to it...
Just work out how much it would cost NOW to do what i have done to this, ON top of buying a car in the first place....LOTS,,,££££££££££££.
So on that basis its a VERY cheap car...
Yes there are some cheap cars on the market, but what are they ACTUALLY like, as most of you know they are usually cheap for a reason....

Yes it is mine, as ive updated to a 968 "toy"...

Hi Dave, I'm sorry to hear you're selling the S2.
For anyone that hasn't seen it, this is a stunning car and I think it's a real bargain at that price (and in probably the best 944 colour available too).
Any details about the new toy?

 

[Big Dave]

Cheers for the nice comments chaps.

Pauly.
This car can + does keep most 968,s in check on track...So apart from the looks + a 6th gear,[ which is hardly used on track]. theres no difference whatsoever...
Peter.
The 968 i have aquired is currently undergoing some "serious" mods.
It had its first outing at Donnington park last month, [ PCGB T day], where the ONLY cars that came past were some VERY well driven 996gt3,s.
It was "pushing" a lot of the 964RS boys...[][][][][].

Back to the S2.
Fen will [im sure], be able to tell most of you just how good it is, after he saw it at Oulton a few years back....[ mostly as it came flying past him...[][][][]]...

 

[Peter Empson]

Cheers Dave, I like the sound of 'serious' mods [] Are you taking it to Silverstone at the weekend?

 

[Neil Haughey]

Well put Fen, I went to Henry F's several years back to look at S2's. He had 2, one of which was a good price, had leather but had really bad paint on the front. He said it was an honest motor and would only cost a couple of hundred quid to put right. I said to him in that case why don't you get the paint done and bump it up 500 quid (it was a good grand to low on price IMHO which had me worried). He didn't answer.

I did however buy the other S2 he had that was lower spec but seemed a solid safe bet and at the time 8 grand was an amazingly good price for a decent dealer supplied S2.

What I am saying is I would advise anyone buying any car from any vendor to have their eyes wide open, look sharp and look carefully at what you are buying. None of the dealers/garages are running a charity for Porsche enthusiasts.

ORIGINAL: Fen

I thought about including Henry, but I didn't for the simple reason a lot of what I have seen from there is, how can I put this? "Honest". I personally probably wouldn't buy a 944 from him these days.

To be fair the 911 I bought from him (around 10 or 11 years ago now) was quite cheap and had nothing major wrong with it, and when it came time to get out of it he got me £250 more than we agreed he woulld on sale or return, but it was far from a nice example and the same could be said of the 944 Lux a mate had from him around the same time.

The downside is that he necessarily has to charge dealer money (though admittedly low dealer money) and the cars are not, in my experience, any better than private. For example he's very realistic about what 17 years of usage can reasonably have done to a car (a polite way of saying many cars are rough around the edges cosmetically) and he won't get the air-con working, so while I didn't have to get him to look at anything on the 911 I bought from him I suspect that a lot of stuff he'd consider to be expected. I believe if you bought a car from him and it put a leg out of bed on the way home he would sort you out, but I suspect a broken seat motor might not.

Dealers have to cover themselves and Porsche parts cost what Porsche parts cost so a very sick 944 S2 costs similar money to fix as a very sick 996, therefore the percentage margin on the 944 has to be higher or it simply isn't worth their while getting involved in the cheaper car. Looking at Henry's website just now I don't see any 944s to see how much he's looking for for an S2 these days, but what strikes me is that little on there is pre-993, which bears out my statement above - it's not really worth getting into the cheaper stuff because of the potentially margin-obliterating costs of standing by a wrong-un.

That holds true to the extent that I can't see there is a business in preparing 944s to the extent that RPM seem to have done and Jon was telling us he's going to do with the cars he currently has - I assume it's an exercise in building a name and corresponding reputation among the enthusiast community that will bring in service work that does make money.

 

[Fen]

ORIGINAL: Big Dave UK

Fen will [im sure], be able to tell most of you just how good it is, after he saw it at Oulton a few years back....[ mostly as it came flying past him...[][][][]]...

I can confirm that Dave in his S2 on his local track was indeed a bit quicker than I was my first time out there in my Turbo - except as I recall for one section toward the end of the day that I forget the name of now...

In any case I'd echo the comments of Peter and confirm that this is a car that has had the maintenance that needed to be done done, plus a lot of potentially not essential improvement work, and it is possibly the best colour to boot.

 

[Big Dave]

ORIGINAL: Peter Empson

Cheers Dave, I like the sound of 'serious' mods [] Are you taking it to Silverstone at the weekend?

Im hoping to be at Silverstone this weekend. Supporting the "Orange" one...Mr Follet. Lets hope the sun shines...[][]. although im not sure which car ill be travelling in....