Turbo "SE" designation
- Thread starter Ewan
- Start date
DavidL
Active member
It would be nice to see brochures from the change over 88/89/90 period for the 944. Surely someone must have something?
Equally a quick trawl of ebay shows that they are rather lacking.
I do wonder though that as the "official" designation of the 250 cars leaves a little to be desired and that the generally accepted spec of an "SE" car is more well known, amongst owners and enthusiasts at least, that it isn't quite a good idea to use it?
Even 952 is "accepted" to relate to a post S turbo even if some object. Note the use of inverted commas if you don't like it - not saying its on the paperwork but we all know what it means.
944 turbo - 220 cars
944 turbo S - special (and rightly so) edition, generally pink with a dodgy interior M758 coded cars
944 turbo SE - post S, 250 cars so no automatic M030 kit or CS wheels etc
Yes there is some cross over around the 88/89 period but broadly I think it holds up and more importantly it reduces some ambiguity when we are discussing individual models.
Works for me and I suspect a few others.
Equally a quick trawl of ebay shows that they are rather lacking.
I do wonder though that as the "official" designation of the 250 cars leaves a little to be desired and that the generally accepted spec of an "SE" car is more well known, amongst owners and enthusiasts at least, that it isn't quite a good idea to use it?
Even 952 is "accepted" to relate to a post S turbo even if some object. Note the use of inverted commas if you don't like it - not saying its on the paperwork but we all know what it means.
944 turbo - 220 cars
944 turbo S - special (and rightly so) edition, generally pink with a dodgy interior M758 coded cars
944 turbo SE - post S, 250 cars so no automatic M030 kit or CS wheels etc
Yes there is some cross over around the 88/89 period but broadly I think it holds up and more importantly it reduces some ambiguity when we are discussing individual models.
Works for me and I suspect a few others.
It's really quite straightforward.
SE = Special Equipment
From the 89 model year, all Turbos were 250 bhp, and had SOME of the Turbo S options as standard.
This became the new base level for the Turbo - so not Special, as in different to other '89 onwards cars.
The SE was simply how Porsche GB chose to market the limited edition Turbo S, and was not used to describe the later Turbos.
SE = Special Equipment
From the 89 model year, all Turbos were 250 bhp, and had SOME of the Turbo S options as standard.
This became the new base level for the Turbo - so not Special, as in different to other '89 onwards cars.
The SE was simply how Porsche GB chose to market the limited edition Turbo S, and was not used to describe the later Turbos.
944 man i agree with you, but this is not where PCGB have any input, my details and paperwork are from Porsche UK (Reading) not PCGB, methink that Porsche UK have confused matters with their branding of 88 MY cars, all i know for sure is that my car is 88 MY M758 exactly same spec as the silverose but it is Black with black interior ??
Whatever it is .................i like it [
]
Whatever it is .................i like it [
]
Ewan
New member
I'm glad I've cleared that up then!
The even better news is that the next page of this brochure gives the official Porsche GB opinion/answer to age old Turbo v S2 issue. So I can clear that one up as well.
I'll try and remember to post that from my office on Monday if i get the chance.
(I'm really tempted to paraphrase the result here now, but I'm sure you'd all rather wait till Monday...)
The even better news is that the next page of this brochure gives the official Porsche GB opinion/answer to age old Turbo v S2 issue. So I can clear that one up as well.
I'll try and remember to post that from my office on Monday if i get the chance.
(I'm really tempted to paraphrase the result here now, but I'm sure you'd all rather wait till Monday...)
Neil Haughey
New member
This has always been my understanding going back 12 years now, not sure where the idea came from of describing all post 88 turbos as SE. I think over enthusiastic car dealers are often to blame for this sort of thing and a couple of dodgy magazine articles from years back.
PSH
PCGB Member
I have to agree with the above, I have most, if not all of the road tests from the auto trade for our beloved cars, the articles covering the SE and S models are all from 1988 and all, from what I can see with a quick re-read, give identical specifications. The only difference being that the SE articles are for the UK market and the S models for the US market. I therefore deduce they are both describing the same car. From 89 all Turbo's are just that 'Turbo' whether in UK or US.
Hope this helps and doesn't increase the discussion, if anyone wants to know something specific I'll try to find an article with the details.
Pete
944 man
Active member
ORIGINAL: Frenchy
944 man i agree with you, but this is not where PCGB have any input, my details and paperwork are from Porsche UK (Reading) not PCGB, methink that Porsche UK have confused matters with their branding of 88 MY cars, all i know for sure is that my car is 88 MY M758 exactly same spec as the silverose but it is Black with black interior ??
Whatever it is .................i like it [
Jim, PCGB is Porsche Cars GB, formerly AFN.
David, I have to disagree (with regards to calling 1989> Turbo models 944 Turbo SE) - youre suggesting using a completely incorrect made-up name because people 'know what it means'. Im strongly in favour of correcting these mistakes, not embracing them.
I don't care
I prefer the 1990 turbo (but only just either are great!) I like a sunroof, I like leather ( I know some S's had leather such as Jim's fine example) , I like the bridge spoiler, I like 17" wheels, I replaced the suspension, I like the 10 speaker stereo. I also believe it is rarer than the TurboS
I am not a fan of the silver rose colour though.
I prefer the 1990 turbo (but only just either are great!) I like a sunroof, I like leather ( I know some S's had leather such as Jim's fine example) , I like the bridge spoiler, I like 17" wheels, I replaced the suspension, I like the 10 speaker stereo. I also believe it is rarer than the TurboS
I am not a fan of the silver rose colour though.
The doc also has a figure of 500 turbo cabs (100 rhd) I have seen different figures for these in different places - never such round numbers. I did wonder when the guide was written and by who? it could be relatively recent so pick up on errors - how modern does it go Ewan?
Tony
Tony
I must admit my M758 car is not as it left the factory now sporting Recaro CS seats ALA 968 and 17" Cup 1's and a few trick bits under the bonnet but nothing that could not be reversed, i have the wheels in the garage and the seats could be changed back to original.
When attending shows and meets a lot of the 89 cars have the M030 option, i did have a 90 Turbo with bridge spoiler etc but it did not have M030.
Just to throw another spanner in, i honestly believe my 86 Turbo is " better built" than the later car.
The debate will go on forever, but what i do know is that my M578 car feels special and focused when on the road compared to other 944's i have owned.
End of the day they are all special and have their own merits, the kick in the back does it for me though, reached a very naughty speed on the M6 recently and it was still pulling like a train when i backed off, i would really like to know what it would top out at []
What has yours done top end MPH on a private road/ track/ Autobahn ??
When attending shows and meets a lot of the 89 cars have the M030 option, i did have a 90 Turbo with bridge spoiler etc but it did not have M030.
Just to throw another spanner in, i honestly believe my 86 Turbo is " better built" than the later car.
The debate will go on forever, but what i do know is that my M578 car feels special and focused when on the road compared to other 944's i have owned.
End of the day they are all special and have their own merits, the kick in the back does it for me though, reached a very naughty speed on the M6 recently and it was still pulling like a train when i backed off, i would really like to know what it would top out at [
]What has yours done top end MPH on a private road/ track/ Autobahn ??
PSH
PCGB Member
They are! ask the experts, ie Porsche .......best year is '86', personally I'd include '85' as well, can't see any reason for them being different as only the last few months of 85 were covered for the turbo, but after '86' things certainly went down hill due mainly to cost and the last of the Cup blocks having been used up. After '86' things changed, cast internals, plain door handles, no brake air ducts etc etc all down to cost.
yes I know I've opened a new can of worms...
Pete
Ah ha Pete, my 88 car does have brake ducts and scripted handles, the 86 car though feels like a soilid old thing and has it's original sills and front wing bottoms which are still in great condition though admittedly it has spent most of it's life garaged.
Can't wait to get my 951 7x8x16 Fuch slapped on there []
Can't wait to get my 951 7x8x16 Fuch slapped on there [
]
PSH
PCGB Member
ORIGINAL: Frenchy
Ah ha Pete, my 88 car does have brake ducts and scripted handles, the 86 car though feels like a soilid old thing and has it's original sills and front wing bottoms which are still in great condition though admittedly it has spent most of it's life garaged.
Can't wait to get my 951 7x8x16 Fuch slapped on there [
IIRC ducts,handles etc were still available but were options, interesting point you make about sills and wing bottoms. I did replace the passengers sill although it could have been saved but i'm a little fusy. I also had a small hole in the lower rear wing section , god knows why but a paid for a brand new OEM rear quarter section just to have the lower section cut off and used to replace the corroded part on my car, I still to this day question my sanity on spending £900 on a panel just to cut it up.. lol
Other than that I've had a small repair on the drivers lower front wing and the passenger wing could do with the same treatment now which is next on the body list. having said this during my 14 years of ownership the car has lived on the drive as I have no garage so i think she's doing well. As a note when the passenger sill was removed the inner sections looked brand new, as if they had never left the factory, I'm confident the bodyshell will out live me.
I like Fuch's...
Pete
edit: just remembered your 88 car is an S which I believe had ducts as standard although I stand to be corrected as always..
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