Oil

[jez_anderson]

Any one tell me what the oil pressure gauge should read whilst driving? Mine goes to the max and generally stays there, although I have noticed it droppping to the middle of the gauge the other day when I came to a stop at a junction. Is this normal?

Also

I was told the 944 was designed to burn a little bit of oil, anyone else heard this/ confirm this?

 

[Guest]

5 when cold, 2.5-3 when warmed up (at idle), and 5 when on the gas. The handbook has some blurb in there about it. You sound OK to me.

As for consumption, My OPC reckoned a litre burns every 1k miles or so on a Turbo. Dunno about n/a's.

 

[sawood12]

Since I got my oil leak fixed my car hasn't used any oil at all which was about 2k miles ago. I know of a few other 944 drivers who's cars also don't burn any oil. I'm not so sure about the car being designed to burn oil - I think it's more of a case of you shouldn't worry if it burns a little oil. It's a similar story on alot of the 911 forums - some cars seem to burn a bit (as the handbook suggests) and others don't use any and no-one seems to suffer either way.

By the way when warm my car idles at around 3.5 bar ish and is 4.5 to 5 bar under throttle.

 

[jez_anderson]

Brill, I can sleep easy, thanks.[]

 

[Riverside]

ORIGINAL: 944Turbo

Im going to disagree, I always use a full synthetic changed every 6k , (though some will get refreshed soooner about 5l in 6k miles []). My car has done over 185k hard miles and the oil pressure never drops below 3.5 bar even on a hot trackday at tickover, on the road its rare to see it go below 4bar.

Mobil1 or Silkolene ProS/R 10/40 or 15/50W (if you live in the south),

Tony

I used to use 10w40 semi synthetic in mine until the oil pressure dropped off from heat at a trackday. It came back up again to normal after I'd let the car cool for a while but I tried fully synthetic instead & haven't had the problem repeat, plus the pressure is a litlle better when hot & it consumes a little less. Personally I'm sold, only put fully synthetic in mine now.

 

[appletonn]

ORIGINAL: 944Turbo

Im going to disagree, I always use a full synthetic changed every 6k , (though some will get refreshed soooner about 5l in 6k miles []). My car has done over 185k hard miles and the oil pressure never drops below 3.5 bar even on a hot trackday at tickover, on the road its rare to see it go below 4bar.

Mobil1 or Silkolene ProS/R 10/40 or 15/50W (if you live in the south),

Tony

I'm going to disagree too! I had 10W/40 semi synth in mine but switched to Castrol Edge Sport (10W/60 and NO it is not thicker than 10W/40, before anyone jumps in with a comment...!) and the oil pressure when truly hot never drops below 3bar (at 135000 miles) at idle and the oil consumption has dropped too.

I do not subscribe to the addage that just because 10/40 semi synth was 'fitted' when new, then despite the advance in oil technology since, you should still use the same old tech oil today.

These are turbo engines with all that they imply (Don't imagine that modern turbo cars are specified with anything other than high grade fully synthetic oils) , hence I would always rather spend the extra money on something that will not break down under duress and hence give me more peace of mind.

Still let it idle for a few seconds after a hard run, though []

 

[pauly]

I had a shop around and the V.W. Synta Gold fully synthetic was a good price, I bought three 5 litre containers and with some discount it was under £60, has suitable for Porsche listed on the container too. []

 

[sawood12]

ORIGINAL: appletonn
I'm going to disagree too! I had 10W/40 semi synth in mine but switched to Castrol Edge Sport (10W/60 and NO it is not thicker than 10W/40, before anyone jumps in with a comment...!) []

Well not strictly true Nick, 10w60 is thicker than 10w40 at 100 degrees C, but is the same viscosity when cold. (by the way, thanks for the tip with Unit 11. I've just bought an A/C condenser off them. Best price around by a country mile!).

First of all i'd only use fully synth for the reasons Andrew has eluded to. No point in not doing so. Secondly 5w40 will provide you with slightly better cold start protection than 10w40, but once upto temp they are both the same viscosity so no difference. The handbook states both grades are perfectly fine for our cars - as is 5w50 and 10w50 at our usual UK climate.

I don't see any point in not using fully synth. It is a bit more expensive, but that's like saying Heinz beans are more expensive than supermarket own brand - they are, but not by that much so it really makes a difference. Use the best and it's one less thing to worry about.

I also would only ever use an Ester based oil for improved cold start protection - afterall the first 10 to 15mins of any journey is where all engine wear occurs. For example Silkolene Pro S is an ester oil. I've also noticed that you can now buy fully synthetic Magnatec in certain grades. I got it in 0w30 for my Focus, though i've not seen it in 5w40 or any of the grades we might use yet.

Also if you use your car 'normally' then a 12k/annual oil change is fine and in accordance with the manual. There was never a 6month 6k mile interval for the 944 turbo contrary to common opinion. The hand book recommends a 6k/6month oil change for the turbo, but there is no stamp for it in the maintenance schedule - only for the 12k annual oil change. I'd say for normal use 12k/12 months (especially if you are using fully synth) but if you take part in track days then of course it is prudent to change the oil more frequently.

I think anything more than a 50 hot grade oil is overkill - unless you are a track warrior or race the car. 944's have oil thermostats and oil coolers and are pretty good at regulating oil temp so there is no need to go to a thicker oil grade in an attempt to manually regulate oil viscosity.

Also varying your oil viscosity to regulate oil pressure is a case of the tail wagging the dog. If you are not achieving decent oil pressure with the oil recommended by Porsche then find out why. Using thicker oils to achieve oil pressure might be masking a more serious and potentially disastrous problem. My car with 120-odd K on the clock and 5w40 achieves 4.5 - 5 bar oil pressure when under throttle and around 3 - 3.5 bar at idle no probs.

I think we worry far too much about oil viscosities. Just use what Porsche recommended and buy a decent quality fully synth and stop worrying about it! I'm not aware of anyone's engine blowing up because they used 5w40 instead of 10w40!

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: sawood12

I also would only ever use an Ester based oil for improved cold start protection - afterall the first 10 to 15mins of any journey is where all engine wear occurs. For example Silkolene Pro S is an ester oil. I've also noticed that you can now buy fully synthetic Magnatec in certain grades. I got it in 0w30 for my Focus, though i've not seen it in 5w40 or any of the grades we might use yet.

Is the magnatec Ester or PAO ?, fully synthetic is a misleading marketing term isn't it, as for wear taking place for 10 to 15 minutes I was under the impression the first 10 to 15 seconds was more critical and providing you wait until the oil (not water)is up to working temp before using more than say 4k revs, you should be fine, but that is just my own opinion.

 

[Hilux]

I think we worry far too much about oil viscosities. Just use what Porsche recommended and buy a decent quality fully synth and stop worrying about it! I'm not aware of anyone's engine blowing up because they used 5w40 instead of 10w40!

Factory fitted gauges induce more panic, needless worry and overspend curing problems that arent there.

If the cars had nothing but a low pressure warning light then we`d all sleep better (as long as it stayed off)

I read the posts re boost pressures and oil pressures that are all related to factory (relatively) inaccurate gauges that primarily serve as a guide as to past history as against what it reads now ie: is the status changing? For real time information install decent accurate gauges and senders however if we all did we`ll get different readings and THEN the panic and discussions will set in []

My view? If the gauge is above 4 at full chat you`re ok. If its above 2 at idle you`re ok. If the gauge flickers then they all do that sir (or check your pulley bolt is tight) All of the aforementioned considered by listening to others whose cars are still going strong I believe.

I do recommend fully synth though but Audi, Vauxhall etc sell good oil cheap, nothing wrong with it as its in their performance cars with 12,000 mile services []

 

[sawood12]

0.266

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: sawood12

I also would only ever use an Ester based oil for improved cold start protection - afterall the first 10 to 15mins of any journey is where all engine wear occurs. For example Silkolene Pro S is an ester oil. I've also noticed that you can now buy fully synthetic Magnatec in certain grades. I got it in 0w30 for my Focus, though i've not seen it in 5w40 or any of the grades we might use yet.

Is the magnatec Ester or PAO ?, fully synthetic is a misleading marketing term isn't it, as for wear taking place for 10 to 15 minutes I was under the impression the first 10 to 15 seconds was more critical and providing you wait until the oil (not water)is up to working temp before using more than say 4k revs, you should be fine, but that is just my own opinion.

Magnatec is Ester (hence clingy) and always used to be semi synthetic which is the misleading marketing term. Fully synth is just that - fully synth. Semi-synth is a mineral oil with a very small element of synthetic such that it can only be considered a mineral oil, this is why there is no point going for semi synth.

You are right in that it is the oil that has to get upto temp before it starts working properly. It takes a good 10 - 15 mins for the oil to temperature soak and get upto operating temp. This is why I think that cold start protection performance of an oil is just as important as hot performance if not more which is why I always go for a low W ester based oil. The ester element protects in the first few seconds at start up where it takes that long for oil to be circulated around the engine, and the low W viscosity protects until the oil gets up into its operating range.

 

[333pg333]

Bottom line. The most important thing to be aware of when selecting your oil of choice is that it contains ZDDPs. There has been a lot of cloak and dagger by the major oil brands and also the reduction of ZDDP content to help in fuel economy amongst other things. Our cars were not designed to use fully synthetic oils or light weight viscosity grades. Look in your owners manual and you'll see a chart stating various oils and what climate you should be using them in. You'd be surprised at how low a temp you can use eg 20w/50. The oil provides lubrication sure, but it also protects in a fashion like suspension. If you have too low a visc and no ZDDPs you increase the chance of top end wear dramatically. I know many of you don't bother with Rennlist, but this is an interesting thread nonetheless.
http://forums.rennlist.com/rennforums/showthread.php?t=450696

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: sawood12

Magnatec is Ester (hence clingy) and always used to be semi synthetic which is the misleading marketing term. Fully synth is just that - fully synth. Semi-synth is a mineral oil with a very small element of synthetic such that it can only be considered a mineral oil, this is why there is no point going for semi synth.

[/quote]

Hmmmn, well I've no axe to grind on this but reading oilmans posts I get the impression magnatec is hydrocracked with a small % of ester for marketing purposes, it may be "fully synthetic" but not "true synthetic", It's all a bit beyond me anyway.

 

[sawood12]

Magnatec always used to be semi-synthetic (i.e. a marketing con), but i've just recently realised that they now do a fully synthetic version - i.e. fully synthetic Magnatec is a new product recently (as far as i've noticed) brought to market. Magnatec is an ester based oil as it is cliny and all clingy oils are ester based.

As long as it is fully synthetic and ester based and a premiun brand then it is alright in my book.

 

[Cater_Racer]

Nope the Mobil 1 15w50 has been replaced by the 10w60

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mobil-10w-60-Extended-Motorsport-Synthetic/dp/B002RPL0X2/ref=pd_sim_sbs_auto_3

Available in 5 litre packs

 

[944 man]

Silkolene/Fuchs Pro is available in this grade, or maybe its a 15W-60. Gulf Competition 15W-50 is a reasonably priced alternative.

People have snapped up the 5l M1R 15W-50, unfortunately.


Simon

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: 1bogis
Any comments on suitable oils? I know nothing. Car is standard non cat S2 with just under 100k on clock, not driven hard.

Search is your friend; we fairly regularly have rows about oil on here and you're better off reading an old one that starting a new one!

(My take on it; cheaper oil, changed every 5000 miles, is a good way forward for sensible motoring. Any 944 engine will have been designed with 30-year-old oil tech in mind, so anything even remotely modern is much better than needed - the car's manual even speaks of using single-grade oil. You don't need to spend a lot to get good oil - look at the API specs on the side of the bottle and try to see how much marketing you are paying for. A good 10W40 semi-synth is fine for an S2 driven as you describe, and I wouldn't waste my money on Mobil 1. A good read is here: http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html)


Oli.

 

[944 man]

Better to ask afresh, in my opinion, than read the old nonsense. 10W-minimum, but 15W is better and as high a top number as you can possibly get -60 in a Turbo, -50 in an S2.

Threads like this always attract 'Wikipedia quoters' though, telling us that its all the same a 100 degrees etc...

 

[944 man]

Cheaper good oil maybe, but cheaper oil can be poor. For example, some blenders use cleaned waste oil (recycled in the popular vernacular) mixed with a sniff of synthetic. Sold for many times their worth these are a very poor bet.

Something like Fuchs 10W-40 semi for £14 per 5l less discount from Opie makes far more sense (and is cheaper than inferior Halfords/Supermarket oils).

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: 944 man
Cheaper good oil maybe, but cheaper oil can be poor. For example, some blenders use cleaned waste oil (recycled in the popular vernacular) mixed with a sniff of synthetic. Sold for many times their worth these are a very poor bet.

Something like Fuchs 10W-40 semi for £14 per 5l less discount from Opie makes far more sense (and is cheaper than inferior Halfords/Supermarket oils).

I'll go along with this all the way. And add that discounts on oils can be significant; a Halfords Trade Card knocks a huge %age (more than 50%, I'm told) off the cost of their oils. I buy GM oils through the Vauxhall Trade Club Scheme for less than £1.70p a litre for high-spec 10W40, and that does my S2 fine. As with all things though, the devil is in the detail; look at the API specs on the side of the tin before you buy it and judge on what you see there; SM or SN is good, SL or less is to be avoided.


Oli.