In his review of the 992 Carrera S Harry (Harry's Garage on YouTube) he mentioned repeatedly the cabin noise. The "infamous" cabin noise is spoiling the enjoyment of my 997.2 C2S MY2009. Sound and noise are not the same thing. Sound enhances the driving experience, contributing to a sense of luxury, power, or enjoyment for the driver and passengers. On the other hand, unwelcome noise in a car refers to sounds that are considered disruptive, unpleasant, or even irritating. Unwelcome noise can negatively impact the comfort and driving experience, reducing the overall satisfaction of being in the car. My 944 Turbo has a great engine and exhaust sound. Even in top gear with an increase in speed, the great sound remains. Admittedly, as speed other non intrusive noises like road and wind are introduced, however, the great sound remains. Similarly the sounds of my Cayman 987.2 is never blighted by unwelcome noise as the speed increases. However, with my 911 997.2 C2S MY2009 as the speed increases, the road noise increases substantially, drowning out the sounds from the engine and exhaust even with OEM Sports exhaust system is engaged. Especially on motorways with an abrasive surface. The noise in my 911 is spoiling my enjoyment of the car. But I hope that somebody here, might be able to offer some constructive comments that could help identify what issues maybe contributing to the excessive road noise? FYI it's not likely to be the tyres. Pirelli P Zero (295 30 ZR19 100Y), I replaced those 1,000 miles ago, and the noise remains. Also I have tried running the tyres at different pressures. My guess, is that another component(s), to the eye look fine but might be past the best. That if replaced will (hopefully) reduce the noise and allow the wonderful sound to be enjoyed. ????
Harry is right, my 911 is too noisy
- Thread starter FrontMidRear
- Start date
Greenman986S
PCGB Member
Can't help on your specific issues other than to say the "noise" in my daily varies greatly depending on the road. Sections of the M25, for example, are incredibly noisy yet other sections and other roads, especially French motorways, are near silent.
I did find that fitting Dynamat to a previous car improved matters.
I did find that fitting Dynamat to a previous car improved matters.
FitzMurray
New member
Agreed, it is road dependant. A smooth surface is fine, but a rough broken surface makes conversation, music and phone calls redundant.Greenman986S said:
Thanks for the sound deadening recomendation, it is a consideration, but I'd more likely sell the car if I can't find a less invasive solution.
My Boxster 981 is very noisy on poor surfaces. Mainly from the rear tyres. when I removed the rear wheel arch liners i can see there is no attempt at deadening inside the liners…and there is an open path along the cill area towards the front of the car….hardly surprising it’s loud. Not sure if 997 etc are similar but might be worth a look. I wear earplugs on bad roads now…but did consider trying some deadening behind the liners.
My 981 GTS is also very noisy and it is all down to the tyres. Standard wheels and tyres are not too bad, but increasing wheel tyre sizes (GT4) really challenges the senses. The concrete sections of the south M25 and the M1 around Leeds are horrendous.
I am not sure there is a fix for this. Some tyre makes are reputed to be quiter than others, but the trouble is that once the frequency registers with the brain, nothing much shifts it. Some have gone to town with sound deadening and there are plenty of areas to apply it. But experimentation is expensive and time consuming so my solution is Bose noise cancelling headphones.
(Having thought the Cayman was bad, the GR Yaris daily is significantly worse, but there you know that no attempts have been made to deaden the sound)
If anyone has attempted to quieten their cars, It would be great if they would post their experiences on here.
I am not sure there is a fix for this. Some tyre makes are reputed to be quiter than others, but the trouble is that once the frequency registers with the brain, nothing much shifts it. Some have gone to town with sound deadening and there are plenty of areas to apply it. But experimentation is expensive and time consuming so my solution is Bose noise cancelling headphones.
(Having thought the Cayman was bad, the GR Yaris daily is significantly worse, but there you know that no attempts have been made to deaden the sound)
If anyone has attempted to quieten their cars, It would be great if they would post their experiences on here.
I drove with JohnCRS (above) down to Monaco last year in my 997.1 C4S with the wider Pirelli P Zero's 305mm on the back, so plenty of tread hitting the tarmac. I don't think it's components wearing out or needing adjustment. there is just no padding or sound deadening in any of the arches and panels into the cabin. UK roads are awful and very droning in patches, by comparison the French side roads and motorways were a dream to drive on.
John,
As someone who spent the majority of his career working on sound and vibration/structural dynamics problems for many of the major vehicle manufacturers I can concur with many of the comments made above.
Although panel, barrier and absorption treatments can be effective in attenuating higher frequency noise I believe that the source of your complaint primarily is lower frequency suspension structure-borne road noise, which is much more difficult to tackle since fundamentally it’s a design issue. I think that we can assume that Porsche has designed a very stiff structure, the powertrain and suspension attachment points in particular, so the body’s sensitivity to noise generated by force inputs at those points should be low, but that’s not always a given owing to phasing effects. Softer suspension system and [if applicable] subframe elastomeric mounts can be beneficial, but usually at the expense of handling … and you can guess which route Porsche has taken on its sports cars! It’s always best first to tackle the source of the noise, and higher profile tyres with more flexible sidewalls can also be beneficial in reducing road-induced noise, but there again Porsche is fitting bigger and bigger wheels with even lower profile tyres.
As you can gather, unfortunately this isn’t good news for you and perhaps your best route is to try either in-ear or over-ear noise cancelling devices to see if that works for you.
One final point: psychoacoustics are playing their part here in that once you’ve heard something you can’t unhear it!??
Jeff
FitzMurray
New member
Like your 981, I very much expwect that my 997 has very little deadening inside the liners. Also disappointing to read that your 981 is very noisy, as I have considered (amongst other options) getting a 981 S or GTS, if I sell my 997.AlistairF said:
FitzMurray
New member
Agreed UK roads are shocking. But last week I was in Ireland. The N4 & N6 motorways were in excellent condition. But there was a significant difference in road surface and therefore noice. A smoother surfaced top layer, and those that were more abrasive. With the abrasive surface exploiting the limitations of the 997's sound deadening...... it was loud. As we know the broken surfaces of the UK roads make it even worse.Porschekit said:
FitzMurray
New member
Motorhead said:
Jeff, pretty much what I expected, but unlike you, I am unable to put is so technically.
Due to variations in hearing abilities or the way our brains process sound. Noise (or sound to the next person) is quite subjective. Maybe the current combined resonance of my 977 is just presenting me with an opportunity to find a solution. Luckily I have a pair of in ear noise cancelling earphones, until I find that solution.
Today I visited my local OPC to ask of their experiences/solutions. They to me like I was the first person to ever mention it. ??
I can concur.
The cabin of my my 2012 (12) 997.2 C4S cab is noisy on most road surface to the extent that I can barely hear the ICE unless I crank it up to loud.
It is particularly unbearable driving on the A30 between Exeter and Honiton where there are a number of mixed surfaces along that stretch.
It of course is probably worse because of the soft-top and I was considering finding if there were more quiet tyres but reading this posting and the replies make me think it is something I am going to have to live with.
FitzMurray
New member
What tre is on your 997.2?boomeruk said:
Only yesterday in the same car park was a guy with his 997.2 Turbo. We started chatting and I asked him about road noice, he said he had none! But it was non since he swapped his tyres to Michelin. Which I am very likely to do soon. Also my Cayman 987.2 runs Michelin Pilot Sport all round, and it is not noisy.
FitzMurray
New member
On another forum someone has helpfully provided a useful YouTube video, especially 4:00 minutes in. ????
https://www.youtube.com/w..?v=WdU-DTIp5lQ&t=3s
https://www.youtube.com/w..?v=WdU-DTIp5lQ&t=3s
My 964 was noisy, my 996T noisy, my 981CS noisy and lastly my 996C2 was noisy. It's a Porsche thing. It varies widely with the type of road surface, european roads are far better having done several trips in my Cayman. I found Michelin PS4S tyres slightly better than P0's
I now have a BMW M240i which is vastly better in this respect, but not as much fun to drive.
I now have a BMW M240i which is vastly better in this respect, but not as much fun to drive.
FitzMurray
New member
Like you I'd not be comfortable wearing any noice cancelling ear/headphones when driving. What Cayman did you have? Because my 987.2 is fine, no noise issues come to mind, and I had it for 9 years. Only had the 997.2 for 18 months, and I was near to selling it before some of the useful responses I've had on a couple of forums. The general consensus is ditching Pirelli for Michelin Pilot Sport, which by coincidence, have been on my Cayman for years.AndrewT said:
FitzMurray
New member
My 987.2 is fine, no noise issues come to mind, and I had it for 9 years. My 944 Turbo is louder and noisier than my Cayman, but not too noisy. It's not a noise issue, of course I understand and expect the Porsche(s) to be noisy, it's about far too much noise, where it makes driving the car a chore on poor/abrasive services over a long distance. In recent weeks I've spoken to a number of Porsche, very few think theirs is too noisy. Hopefully, I'll find the solution, so I can enjoy my 997 as much as my 2 other Porsche ????mr pg said:
I really sympathise with your frustrations John, in particular because of my vehicle refinement experience to which I alluded in my previous post.
Whilst it may seem odd that your experiences with your 987.2 Cayman and 997.2 911 are very different, and although both vehicles share the same body structure, steering and suspension components forward of the A-pillar, the rear suspension layouts are very different - strut versus multi-link - with the 911 having different [more?] attachment points and therefore different [more?] potential sources of force input due to road excitation. Whether or not that’s the reason for the differences or if the different tyres are playing their part is an open question.
Unfortunately I think that your only course of action is to try different tyres from your recently fitted P-Zeros, at significant cost, although probably you could sell your lightly-used tyres. However, although you’d need to look carefully at potentially different wheel offsets to avoid fouling the wheel arches, it may be possible to swap the 911’s wheels for those on your Cayman to evaluate the Michelins on your 911.
There’s also the open question of whether or not using N-rated tyres will make any difference since they will have been developed specifically for your cars, perhaps taking noise into account, and you haven’t indicated what you’re using on both cars. Note also that although new tyre labelling includes exterior noise produced it doesn’t necessarily mean that a lower value will mean that it will be quieter inside the car.
Jeff
Whilst it may seem odd that your experiences with your 987.2 Cayman and 997.2 911 are very different, and although both vehicles share the same body structure, steering and suspension components forward of the A-pillar, the rear suspension layouts are very different - strut versus multi-link - with the 911 having different [more?] attachment points and therefore different [more?] potential sources of force input due to road excitation. Whether or not that’s the reason for the differences or if the different tyres are playing their part is an open question.
Unfortunately I think that your only course of action is to try different tyres from your recently fitted P-Zeros, at significant cost, although probably you could sell your lightly-used tyres. However, although you’d need to look carefully at potentially different wheel offsets to avoid fouling the wheel arches, it may be possible to swap the 911’s wheels for those on your Cayman to evaluate the Michelins on your 911.
There’s also the open question of whether or not using N-rated tyres will make any difference since they will have been developed specifically for your cars, perhaps taking noise into account, and you haven’t indicated what you’re using on both cars. Note also that although new tyre labelling includes exterior noise produced it doesn’t necessarily mean that a lower value will mean that it will be quieter inside the car.
Jeff
Posts made and opinions expressed are those of the individual forum members
Use of the Forum is subject to the Terms and Conditions
