Excessive water use

[WBray]

ORIGINAL: zcacogp

Yes, it always drops on the first decent length drive I do after topping up. I think it spits it all out of the overflow - I've never looked to find out. Gets down to a bit below minimum and stops just fine there.

I bet this is exactly what yours is doing as well. Tell you what, save the money you were going to spend on that pressure test and watch where the level gets to for the next few times you drive it. When it gets to the 'Min' (or a bit below), don't fill it up, just leave it. Watch the temperature gauge very closely next time you drive it, and check the level again. If it doesn't get any lower then buy me and Ed a beer should we ever meet.

Deal? []


Oli.

sounds interesting, should be going for a average length drive on thursday so shall have a gander then and monitor from there.
unfortunatly I have a tempermental water temp gauge which I have changed the senders for but still plays up and after speaking to SCS he thinks its warn out over time, it either shows the car as at a good temperature or boiling (which can show boiling from starting).

otherwise sounds like an alright deal to me, I shall make a meet at some point, just annoying in the arse end of nowhere lol

 

[andy watson]

"if you fill my S2 up to 'Maximum' it spits it out to just below the 'minimum' level and settles at that"

But Will hasn't got an S2!

I would suggest that the HG has given up, not long after I bought my car I noticed creamy mayo around the oil filler as well as minor topping up of water, it was suggested that the mayo was due to condensation and perfectly normal

After a year or so I took the car to another garage (after 2 satisfactory compression tests) and asked them to look into it as a second opinion, the compression test they carried out proved fine, although no. 2 was slightly down, the car had been using about 1 pint roughly every 500 miles, so with the car running they took out the spark plugs and hey presto no. 2 - vapour.

They rang me to give me the bad news and asked me to go down so they could show me as evidence they were not just saying the HG had gone, when I arrived the car was started no 2 plug removed, no vapour!
It was concluded that the HG had a small split and when the car warmed up it would seal itself and it was recommended the HG be changed, at the time I didn't use the car much, never went that far in it and decided I would leave it a while, the mayo never got any worse and never used any more than the pint of water of the 500 miles or so.

Finally it gave up one day after filling up with fuel went to start her and the engine didn't fire, then the noise of a very free spinning engine as I tried to start again, the HG had gone filled up number 2 and hydraulically locked snapped the cam chain, busted the head and who knows what else? replacement engine was fitted.

This long winded post is me saying don't risk driving it with that amount of water loss without finding out the cause, otherwise it could get expensive.

My car since having the replacement engine does not use water other than normal vaporation and no creamy mayo has ever been seen again.

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: andy watson

But Will hasn't got an S2!

True, and the two reference points given thus far have both been S2 owners. However all 944's have basically the same cooling system and I understand this 'quirk' is not solely confined to S2's. Will would do well to be careful (as your story shows), but I stand by my diagnosis as being the most likely explanation.


Oli.

 

[Diver944]

Same here.

My S2 coolant level has always dropped down to the 'Min' marker but then stayed there.

 

[zcacogp]

Good thread bump Smiffy.

I was musing on this last night. Why would Porsche, who were pretty good at their engineering, make a radiator system that is clearly wrongly-marked in this way? The problem of 944's draining their coolant to just below the 'Min' mark is a common one, and Porsche must have known about it from their pre-production testing, if not from years of maintaining the cars themselves once sold.

Which made me wonder whether this is a 'feature' that has established itself over time - i.e. it's a product of the cars being old. How could this change? Is it that the engines are sitting lower in the engine bays than they should be, hence the levels on the header tank are higher than they should be? Or would this not change things, because it's the level of the radiator that matters?

If it IS the engine height that is critical, could this be a sign of worn (and collapsed) engine mounts, causing the engine to sink? How much do the engine mounts drop by when they do collapse? Is it by about the same distance as the difference between "Max" and "Min" on the header tanks?

Just a thought. Will, keep us updated with what you find out, and let me and Ed know when you can buy us a beer! []


Oli.

 

[andy watson]

That's excellent news Oli, my engine mounts are like new [][]

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: andy watson

That's excellent news Oli, my engine mounts are like new [][]

Is that a statement of fact, or a deduction based on my musings and the fact that your coolant levers don't go down to just below 'Min' and stay there?


Oli.

 

[andy watson]

Hee hee, purely by deduction []

Seriously though it is interesting that the S2's are sitting at min, maybe time for a poll?

 

[Diver944]

That is an interesting theory Oli. My original mounts were actually replaced a few months ago at the same time as a coolant change, so I will go and check the level tomorrow to see if it's still at the MIN or now proudly up to the MAX.

 

[zcacogp]

Andy,

I've never done a poll on here ... if you are clever enough to make such majik work then please go ahead! Can you make it a poll that looks at the level of coolant in the header tank as well as the age of the engine mounts? And also the model of 944, natch? I don't know whether this is possible.

Smiffy - keep us posted. Or you could complete Andy's poll ... []


Oli.

 

[robdimond]

My coolant sits at the max mark. Pretty sure it's still on the original engine mounts.

After draining all the coolant to fit the water pump, the level dropped to just below min after the first run. I topped it up to max and it's stayed there since...

 

[andy watson]

Don't know how to set up a poll - Cue Mr Mcnulty!

 

[pauljmcnulty]

Don't know how to set up a poll - Cue Mr Mcnulty!

Not sure this needs a poll....

If your 944 is losing coolant there is a problem. If it sits on "min", and never loses any coolant, there isn't a problem. [8|]

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: andy watson

Don't know how to set up a poll - Cue Mr Mcnulty!

Mr Mcnnulty?

Now you're sounding well posh!


Oli.

 

[WBray]

Right going to phone Andy at SCS Porsche tomorrow/today (27th) and see what he says, and double check if he compression checked it, as think he chemical tested the head.
If not going to contact my old school mechanic I use in this neck of the woods and see if he can do a compression test for me I rekon just gonna be annoying getting the time to take it to the garage though possibly with work atm.
Thanks for all your input guys,

Will

 

[edh]

ORIGINAL: WBray

Right going to phone Andy at SCS Porsche tomorrow/today (27th) and see what he says, and double check if he compression checked it, as think he chemical tested the head.
If not going to contact my old school mechanic I use in this neck of the woods and see if he can do a compression test for me I rekon just gonna be annoying getting the time to take it to the garage though possibly with work atm.
Thanks for all your input guys,

Will

Will

One thing that hasn't been mentioned on this thread that is dead easy - get an MOT station to stick their gas analyser over the top of the expansion tank (cap open ) If it detects hydrocarbons then you have a headgasket problem. takes about a minute. A compression test might not be conclusive, but the gas test should be.

I still bet it's a leak (or nothing) []

 

[steve 944t]

ORIGINAL: edh

ORIGINAL: WBray

Right going to phone Andy at SCS Porsche tomorrow/today (27th) and see what he says, and double check if he compression checked it, as think he chemical tested the head.
If not going to contact my old school mechanic I use in this neck of the woods and see if he can do a compression test for me I rekon just gonna be annoying getting the time to take it to the garage though possibly with work atm.
Thanks for all your input guys,

Will

Will

One thing that hasn't been mentioned on this thread that is dead easy - get an MOT station to stick their gas analyser over the top of the expansion tank (cap open ) If it detects hydrocarbons then you have a headgasket problem. takes about a minute. A compression test might not be conclusive, but the gas test should be.

I still bet it's a leak (or nothing) []

Exactly this. I got a local garage to do a quick "sniff test" which very quickly confirmed a failed head gasket (they didn't even charge me for doing it).. The car drove fine, but was pressurising the coolant and blowing it out of the overflow. My Indy then stripped the head off, confirming the gasket had failed between 3 and 4, as is becoming pretty common it seems. With hindsight I think mine had been leaking very slightly for some time, finally being killed off completely at the Bedford track day.

I hope yours turns out to be something else, but a sniff test should confirm or (hopefully) rule out a head gasket issue. Best of luck

 

[WBray]

Thats an interesting idea I've never heard of before! After speaking to Andy at SCS I've got her booked into a good VAG indy garage down here to do a compression test and a leak down test next friday as thats unfortunately the soonest they could book it in.
While in the mean time she got taken to a different garage today (my old skool mechanic I used on other cars) as I managed to break the NS anti-roll bar bracket :/

 

[zcacogp]

Any more news on this one chaps?


Oli.

 

[WBray]

Been a little quite as not had the car for 2weeks as snapped the antirollbar link and gave it to my local mechanic to sort when he had time as I didn't. Booked in tomorrow with the best VAG independent down here as its the best I've got for a leak down and pressure test and will get them to try putting the exhaust probe in the reservoir as well.