Crank Seal Part Two!!!

[timfield]

I'm hoping that this isn't going to be a event that needs as many sequels as Police Academy!!!

Thanks for the previous advice the crank seal was leaking and the oil pump drive had a lovely groove in it from the seal! I'm quite pleased with myself for getting the new belts on and the car still works!!! I had the balance shaft belt two tight to start with but slackened it off and the super charger sound has now gone.
The only down side to the whole operation appears to be that having fixed the crank seal and cleaned up all that oil what appears to be the biggest part of the leak is coming from behind the bottom balance shaft housing! DOH!

I don't know if this is a common problem or I am just unlucky!

my question is can I remove the whole balance shaft housing and potentially the oil cooler housing with the engine in the car?
I was thinking I might just order tonnes of seals from that area and do the whole lot or are some best left untouched unless they and definitely leaking??

cheers

Tim
PS for those of you thinking about doing the belts on your cars they are not as hard as some people would have you think! But I'm going to refrain from calling it easy until I have covered at least 10K without total engine failure!!!!

 

[PSH]

Hi Tim

when you say behind the bottom balance shaft housing are you referring to the rear seal? if so it's a bitch of a job and although I wouldn't say impossible to do while the engine is still in the car It would be best to remove the engine and do everything while it's out.
Over the years I have replaced most seals on my engine but the rear seal was on my list to do once the engine was out due to how much stuff needs to be removed to get the balance shaft housing off. However there is a way to temporary reduce or even stop the leak without taking the housing apart. The rear seal fit's over the rear plug/cap and is then compressed into the recesses in both the block and the housing when refitted. This seal donut gets hot and hard over time and shrinks which stops it sealing, you can tell if it's failed by checking it's movement, if the cap moves freely and you are able to pull it out a little you know that the seal needs replacing. However this design does allow you to fit a larger rubber gromet or seal by pulling the metal cap back just enough so that you can force the seal over it compressing it between the caps outer lip and the rear of the housing. In doing this the cap is forced backwards and thus sealing the chamber, how long this lasts will depend on how good a seal/grommet you find to do the job, it needs to be very resistant to heat, silicon would probably be best. Please note this is a temporary fix and not a Porsche way of doing things but it works..

Pete

 

[PSH]

This picture may help, As you can see I'm currently working on my own engine out of the car, here is the rear of the bottom balance shaft showing the cap and you can also just see the new seal. Without the seal the cap moves very freely due to being so much smaller that the housing opening so when the old seal shrinks due to age and heat the cap becomes free and the oil can easily flow out.

Hope this helps


Pete

Edit: the nick out of the housing that you can see is the result of me prying the cap back with a flat screw driver so as to force a larger seal over the cap lip and thus cause it to seal while the engine was still in the car. This worked for a few years before the seal shrunk again, I had done this to both the top and bottom housings as a temporary seal, something recommended to me by Jon Mitchel a long time ago...

 

[timfield]

hi Guys

Luckily it's not that seal but something at the other end of that balance shaft? It's not the seal right by the belt pully that looked perfect which is why I thought it was just the crank seal gone and spraying oil all about the place. But somewhere behind the power steering mounting bracket that houses the front bearing for the balance shaft.
I can't see if it's coming out of the oil cooler housing or from this area of the balance shaft? I don't think it's the oil pressure sender but not totally sure and wouldn't know how to remove that to check it anyway, as there just isn't any room???

Any ideas or just invest in all the gasgets and seals and start ripping it apart? But can the oil cooler housing even come off with the engine in the car?

cheers
tim

Just to say that engine looks newer than new! totally amazing!

 

[PSH]

ok Tim.. is this picture of more use.... the bottom balance shaft bearing holder if off in this picture whereas the top shaft is in place. Perhaps it's the large 'O' ring that seals the bearing holder to the block that has failed

I just took this picture to show you the seal that may have failed, here you can see a new 'O' ring fitted to the bottom balance shaft front bearing housing. This could be the seal that's failed, of course it could also be the oil cooler housing as you say due to it being very close behind this housing.

regards

Pete

 

[timfield]

That looks like a good culprit for the leak!
With the belts off again! I presume that housing is easy to get at? But have you tried removing the oil cooler housing whilst the engines in the car?
Again I presume it becomes possible once the balance shaft housing is off but I couldn't even tighten the oil pressure sender with it on. Even with the power steering pump slackened off.

Maybe one day my engine might look like that???

 

[PSH]

I'm pretty sure that the cooler housing can be taken off without removing the engine, the seals were changed on mine by an independent when the car was new to me and they certainly didn't remove the engine. I see no reason for the need to remove the balance housing to get at the cooler, at least not on the Turbo, unless I'm missing something here.


btw, 12 months ago my engine was far from being clean, looked ok from above but had many leaks below due to age and the various seals shrinking/hardening which in turn causes them to fail.

Pete

 

[jakerade]

it can be done easily if you have the engine mounts/cross member removed. Its more of a fiddle with all that in place. Also you have to remember the exhaust manifold is in the way and on a RHD there is the steering rack to contend with

 

[timfield]

cheers guys!

I think I'm going to order the front seal to the balance shaft and the O ring. If I need more parts it'll have to stay at the garage in pieces until they arrive. It'll have to have the push of shame to a space outside until the postman can bring the bits!

So hopefully I'll just need the two parts!
Cheers once again
Tim

 

[PSH]

ORIGINAL: timfield

cheers guys!

I think I'm going to order the front seal to the balance shaft and the O ring. If I need more parts it'll have to stay at the garage in pieces until they arrive. It'll have to have the push of shame to a space outside until the postman can bring the bits!

So hopefully I'll just need the two parts!
Cheers once again
Tim

If your changing the front seal Tim it's worth replacing the top hat at the same time as I'll bet that yours will have a groove worn into it's neck and possibly around it's flange as well. If it is leaking and if the top hat does indeed have a groove it is very likely to keep leaking after you fit the new seal.

regards

Pete

edit: just thought that calling them top hats may not explain well enough what I'm referring too, basically it's the sleeves that slide over the shafts and run between them and the front seals.