Car Broken Down and Stuck in France - Help!

[EddySpaghetti]

Hi All,

I had a bit of a disaster on Friday - broke down on the way back from holiday in France (In a tool booth, naturally).

Fortunately I had RAC Comprehensive European breakdown cover, so I got home with my girlfriend OK, the problem no is that the car is in France and the insurer are refusing to repatriate it on the basis the repair cost is greater than the value f the vehicle.

I think the repair could just be a wheel bearing or a seized / broken handbreak shoe(s) in the left rear wheel: It won't turn when the weight of the car is on it, although it did turn, and the other wheel went the other way around, when it was on a jack. The problem is that the garage in France are saying that it needs a full gearbox rebuild and quoting up to 6k Euros.

This is compounded by the RAC claiming the vehicle value is only £3k, so the net result is that they won't repatriate on the basis that the car isn't worth the repair (which I would have to pay for in any case).

I could really use some help with advice on:

1) How to get a more reasonable (formal) valuation that an Insurance company would have to listen to.

2) Worst case repair costs if it needed a 'new' (secondhand) 'box.

Cheers!

Ed

 

[craig2105]

Whoa, what a nightmare...

Just wondering if the French club could help in any way? Perhaps if someone knowledgeable could take a look a t the car and offer a second opinion? Call me suspicious but I can't help thinking the garage is hoping for a bumper insurance payout and is quoting accordingly.

Whereabouts in France is the car?

 

[Super_Marv]

I had a bit of a disaster on Friday - broke down on the way back from holiday in France (In a tool booth, naturally).

Fortunately I had RAC Comprehensive European breakdown cover,
Ed

I'm surprised with comprehensive cover, they didn't flat bed it back to England for you.

 

[Cater_Racer]

Hi Ed,

I'm in France can I help?

I've not got my car with me (came in the wife's car), returning later in the month.

If I can help let me know.

Gerry

 

[Mike_Pollock]

My guess would be c/v joint.
But Gearbox s/hand 200-250 pounds, plus 4 hours labour - that's me on the drive at home - garage should be less.

Do wheels have play when off the ground (hand brake and brakes off) ?
If they do = bearing
As they rotate ok off the floor - assuming.no horrible noises - could be gearbox.

 

[TTM]

Where is the car, and at which sort of garage?

 

[pauljmcnulty]

1) How to get a more reasonable (formal) valuation that an Insurance company would have to listen to.

Hi Ed,

Sorry to hear the problems. I could try to do a valuation for you if you send details to me.

It's a long shot, though. Only the Club's official valuer is industry-approved, so the insurer had every reason to ignore one from someone like me, I think the Tipec valuations are similarly not accepted by all companies. Secondly, they tend to be a bit unwilling to accept valuations after the event; you really need an agreed-value policy in order for them to have no getout. You can't force an insurance company to agree with you, it's their business to keep the value as low as possible. [&o]

 

[VanhireBoys]

ORIGINAL: Super_Marv
I'm surprised with comprehensive cover, they didn't flat bed it back to England for you.

+1 on that... Im surprised as well. I just checked my AXA policy and if its a catastrophic failure they take the car home - no matter if its in Europe

It all sounds a bit suss to me. As said earlier - someone is trying to milk the system. You really need an independant 3rd party to go pay a visit to that garage and see what exactly they are playing at

 

[EddySpaghetti]

Thanks for the quick responses guys!

Gerry, its very kind to offer help, but not sure what you would be able to do, and certainly wouldn't want to interrupt your holiday, but see below for my plan of attack here...

Car is currently in a garage somewhere near Tours in France. Its just a garage that collects cars from the Autoroute, definitely not a Porsche, or Marque, specialist.

The comprehensive cover should by default include recovery to the UK, especially since it happened on the last day of my holidays, and the policy states it should be recovered or repaired by the end of the vacation, so I don't think that RAC have an argument beyond this clause about not recovering the vehicle if the cost of repair is greater than the value of the car.

Basically I need to get them some evidence / backup for a valuation greater than the cost of fixing the problem, which I aim to do by showing them the price of a replacement gearbox (possibly shipped to France from the UK), and some evidence that the car is worth a lot more than £3k when repaired. Its an important exercise to get them to meet their commitments, but ultimately wont lead to an actual repair in France, since I would like to get the car recovered to a UK specialist to have a proper look as per the policy agreement, I'm not 100% convinced the 'box is minced yet. The annoying thing is that they insist on evaluating the cost of the repair in France, which seems a bit perverse, but there you go - I could more easily get a quote for repair in the UK only...

If anyone with French connections could help me get a theoretical quote for sourcing a replacement (2nd hand) gearbox in France, and shipment and fitting costs (in hours, or Euros) then that would be extremely helpful data to present to them, and I would be eternally grateful!

I did have an agreed value policy for the car that ran out just shortly before the trip (during which time it was insured on my GF's policy temporarily), so I will try to locate that proof and send it to them, hopefully that wil persuade them its worth a bunch more than 3k, I think I had 8k agreed and that was before a bunch of bodywork done in the last couple of months. Failing that, does anyone know if the valuation I input when pricing the 'driving' (ie not breakdown) cover to add the car to my GF's policy is worth anything - I think we put it in for about 8k again and should have recent docs to that effect.

For the purposes of a valuation from Paul (Thanks a lot mate!) - its a 1990 G Reg Turbo SE, White with Pinstripe interior. Have recent receipts (last two years, 10k miles) for all new belts / rollers / waterpump, new clutch, new shocks all round and repaired sills, front and rear wings and a few other dings taken out plus respray of both sides.

It also has a working clock (true) and the aircon just needs a re-gas (possibly true). ~117k miles, Sunroof works and it has refurbed wheels too. £3k my ar$£

If I need to get a rough quote for sending a 'box from the UK, who would be good to ask? - I will contact the people I already know, but who was the specialist in Liverpool Markofay?

Thanks again!

Ed

 

[EddySpaghetti]

Just one more thing - I didn't get much time to investigate, but I don't think there was a lot of play in the wheel once it was jacked up, and spinning it didn't make any grinding noises, although it was well a truly seized with weight on it - it screeched across the tarmac when being pulled up onto the flatbed loader

The official diagnosis went something like (by text message!): "Rear brake failure locked wheel and gearbox needs full re-build... 4.5k - 6k Euros to repair."

Its a joke, and at this point I'm trying to remain confident that I just need to get a few docs / quotes together to show that they need to repatriate it for me, at which point someone I trust could have a proper look see at what happened...

 

[robwright]

Why don't you ask if Elliot or Alasdair will give you a quote to courier a second hand box out to France? They don't actually have to have a box but both have dedicated couriers that they do busines with. I know for sure that Elliot does. Failing that if all else fails and you get sick of the arguing I would consider hiring a trailer and going to get the thing myself. I am sure the whole operation would only take about 24 hours.

 

[vitesse]

That's what I would do-someone might lend you a trailor-Melv might do foreign trips of course-or one of those recovery outfits that fits under 2 wheels-you would have to lock the steering centrally & tow it on the front wheels.

 

[TTM]

So basically if you provide your insurance company with a quote from a French garage then they will have the car flat-bedded back to the UK?

Would that be a problem if the quote is made by a garage not based in Tours?

 

[EddySpaghetti]

Hey TTM,

That's it yeah, I think if I show them that the cost of a replacement 'box and fitting is a lot less than a rebuild then they will have to accept that the repair is less than the value of the car and that they should adhere to the contract and repatriate it for me.

So if I can get a French garage to quote for the purchase and fitting of a replacement then they shouldn't have a leg to stand on - based on what's been said above I don't think it would come to more than a grand and they have already valued the car at £3k themselves, although I'm working on the evidence to push that figure up too.

If you have any connections that could provide a quote like that it would be fantastic, although I feel a bit bad asking for a quote that wouldn't result in a sale since the whole point is to get the car back to the UK. Like I said they are being a bit funny about the cost of repair having to be the 'cost to repair in France, not the UK'...

If you can help, that would be great,

Thanks!

Ed

 

[TTM]

Just sent a PM to a 944 guy in Tours that I know, will get back to you asap.

 

[chrisg]

Whatever anyone tells you, Porsche speciallist or not is doesn't cost E6K to rebuild a gearbox, even a Turbo with an LSD !

I had mine done by an indie last year, complete strip down, rebuild and refit = £2.5k.......

Tour = Northern France IMSC ? If you can't get a 2nd hand box either from France or the UK, I would plump for the trailer hire and collect in person, even with diesel and autoroute fees shouldn't cost more than £1,500 all in to collect the car.

Chris

 

[simdel1]

I'm totally baffled by this. How can the value of the vehicle and the cost of repair factor into a vehicle recovery dispute? Surely if you've paid for european recovery, you have european recovery! I'll never understand these things, but I'll definitely be checking the small print on any policy I take out to cover me If I ever do that 'ring trip.

Good luck with getting this sorted.

 

[TTM]

ORIGINAL: chrisg
Whatever anyone tells you, Porsche speciallist or not is doesn't cost £6K to rebuild a gearbox, even a Turbo with an LSD !

My take is that they don't really know what's wrong with the car and feel like replacing the gearbox with a rebuilt unit from Porsche (€€€) to make sure they can rule out the gearbox.
It wouldn't be the first time so called "pros" try to make some butter on the back of insurance companies, and as a foreigner Ed stands as a perfect victim.

 

[loc944]

Sounds to me like the Recovery company (who I think you said is RAC - One of the Big ones) is trying to dodge the cost of RECOVERING your car back to the UK. The way I understood these things was if they can't get you going at the roadside they would recover you to a Garage of your choice or to your Home address. Is this different for European Policy.
I also don't understand how the vehicle value has anything to do with it as it's your car,your premium isn't affected by age or value so if you want to repair your car at whatever cost to you is your choice. Sounds like they are trying to say it's scrap so won't recover it to UK.
As previously mentioned I,d find a Freind or Relative with a Towbar fitted and beg, steal or borrow a trailer( I'm sure in the circumstances someone will help) and go get Your Pride and Joy back.
Where in UK are you?

Best of luck, Alan.

 

[Frenchy]

You will need a trailer that takes all four wheels, i heard the towing dolly's which lift only 2 wheels are illegal in Spain and France, something does not sound right here, surely if the car was only worth a hundred quid they should bring it back, i cannot see what value has to do with it.