3.0 944 turbo

[u63af]

I have a 2.7 head already. Can I use the can out if this or do I need turbo cam? Take it all I need to do is have the exhaust valves of a turbo put in?

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: nick_968

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: TTM

The right way to build a 3.0 is the same way as to build a 2.5 - either build it the way Porsche did, underpowered but unburstable, and it will go to the moon and back, or take the chance to make it a decent performer and risk having issues. It's as simple as that.

What about the turbo engine with an S2 crank etc for 2.8 ?.

Its a good solution but not a true 3.0. Depends what you want but certainly nothing wrong with it from an engineering point of view. Andrew Sweetnam built a very nice 2.8 that made some strong numbers a few years back that left many a fast car wondering which way it went on track.

For the sake of an S2/968 crank assy and some suitable pistons I cant see a reason not to do it if you wanted to keep the original block and head.

 

[nick_968]

You can use the cam but it will have more overlap than a turbo cam. Ideally you want a custom cam for a 3.0 but the standard 2.5 turbo cam is the next best option.

 

[DivineE]

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: TTM

The right way to build a 3.0 is the same way as to build a 2.5 - either build it the way Porsche did, underpowered but unburstable, and it will go to the moon and back, or take the chance to make it a decent performer and risk having issues. It's as simple as that.

What about the turbo engine with an S2 crank etc for 2.8 ?.

Yes. For the record this is most likely the way I would go if I ever had another 944 turbo. You can do it but you need custom pistons or the pistons come out the top of the bores!

Nick, yes thanks I meant water way not oil way sorry. As for the 3.0 vs turbo block. I can see there are arguments for both but I personally have more faith in the turbo block from my experiences. As I said above I would go for a long stroked turbo next time. Low end torque closer to a 3.0 than 2.5, capable of 400hp (which is as much as most run from their 3.0 cars) but much closer to the 2.5 set-up and easier to build.

 

[TTM]

So what are your plans Pauly?

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: TTM

So what are your plans Pauly? 

No definate plan Thom, like I've said if the block/head turn up for the right price I'll start a build, if not I'll save a shed load of money and aggravation.

 

[944 man]

ORIGINAL: u63af

I have a 2.7 head already. Can I use the can out if this or do I need turbo cam? Take it all I need to do is have the exhaust valves of a turbo put in?

The valves in the 2.7l 8v head are larger than in the previous 2.5l engine.

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: 944 man

ORIGINAL: u63af

I have a 2.7 head already. Can I use the can out if this or do I need turbo cam? Take it all I need to do is have the exhaust valves of a turbo put in?

The valves in the 2.7l 8v head are larger than in the previous 2.5l engine.

Just the inlet valves I think.

 

[944 man]

I suppose that its really only the exhaust valves that matter.

 

[nick_968]

ORIGINAL: DivineE

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: TTM

The right way to build a 3.0 is the same way as to build a 2.5 - either build it the way Porsche did, underpowered but unburstable, and it will go to the moon and back, or take the chance to make it a decent performer and risk having issues. It's as simple as that.

What about the turbo engine with an S2 crank etc for 2.8 ?.

Yes. For the record this is most likely the way I would go if I ever had another 944 turbo. You can do it but you need custom pistons or the pistons come out the top of the bores!

Nick, yes thanks I meant water way not oil way sorry. As for the 3.0 vs turbo block. I can see there are arguments for both but I personally have more faith in the turbo block from my experiences. As I said above I would go for a long stroked turbo next time. Low end torque closer to a 3.0 than 2.5, capable of 400hp (which is as much as most run from their 3.0 cars) but much closer to the 2.5 set-up and easier to build.

What makes you favour the 2.5 block other than the theoretical arguement, did you have a bad experience with a 3.0 turbo block?

 

[pauly]

I've been trawling Rennlist re 3.0 builds and the more I read the less inclined I feel to take one on, one of the most respected 3.0 builders on there suggests the 2.5 can be plenty strong enough for the road with the right mods and a couple of larger capacity owners on here have told me the same in the past.

 

[TTM]

I suppose it depends what floats your boat.

What I can say is that my 2.5 clearly didn't provide the bold thrill of the 3.0 in terms of power delivery.
To describe the feeling, the closest image I can think of is that of a prehistoric human orgasmically planting a big axe into a mammoth. Stupidly enjoyable in a very primitive, electrifying kind of way.

The road to making a good one can be long and painful depending on what is done with all the information available, but if it was just a matter of money where would be the challenge?

 

[nick_968]

ORIGINAL: TTM

Stupidly enjoyable in a very primitive, electrifying kind of way.

The road to making a good one can be long and painful depending on what is done with all the information available, but if it was just a matter of money where would be the challenge?

Well said. Its a well trodden path nowdays but even then few get it right, first time if at all.

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: TTM

The road to making a good one can be long and painful depending on what is done with all the information available, but if it was just a matter of money where would be the challenge?

Hmmmnn, not sure I want to be £15k + into a car worth a few k less.

 

[Lowtimer]

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: TTM

The road to making a good one can be long and painful depending on what is done with all the information available, but if it was just a matter of money where would be the challenge?

Hmmmnn, not sure I want to be £15k + into a car worth a few k less.

Except for those who buy a sub £1,000 banger with a view to never opening the bonnet, running it 'til it stops, and then breaking it, almost everyone is going to be a lot of money into a car which worth at least a few K less than what they've spent*. A 944 can't be expected to be any different.

 

[pauly]

ORIGINAL: Lowtimer

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: TTM

The road to making a good one can be long and painful depending on what is done with all the information available, but if it was just a matter of money where would be the challenge?

Hmmmnn, not sure I want to be £15k + into a car worth a few k less.

Except for those who buy a sub £1,000 banger with a view to never opening the bonnet, running it 'til it stops, and then breaking it, almost everyone is going to be a lot of money into a car which worth at least a few K less than what they've spent*. A 944 can't be expected to be any different.

Depends how you buy, after owning one 3 years I could remove most of what I've added, refit original bits and I doubt I'd be a bag down.

 

[Lowtimer]

Well, yes, quite true: if you have the necessary skills to do all your own work on the car, and cost your time at £0 an hour, of course it is possible to operate at very low cost.

 

[TTM]

ORIGINAL: pauly
Hmmmnn, not sure I want to be £15k + into a car worth a few k less.

Yes but you will have a car able to copiously embarass others worth 3 to 4 times as much as your car + the investment.
Putting it all together at the back of a uncomfortable garage adds a rather priceless sense of satisfaction.
As I said earlier, it depends what floats your boat. If you could afford to pay someone to do it, the flavour would not be the same, to me at least.

The Oedipus comment went well above my head I must say!

 

[944 man]

Mine too. Didnt he kill his father and marry his mother?

 

[nick_968]

ORIGINAL: pauly

ORIGINAL: TTM

The road to making a good one can be long and painful depending on what is done with all the information available, but if it was just a matter of money where would be the challenge?

Hmmmnn, not sure I want to be £15k + into a car worth a few k less.

Looks like you have come to the right conclusion then....dont build a 3.0 turbo! At least not a bells and whistles version. Others such as James O have done it for a lot lot less and probably less than a 2.8 built by someone else.