1983 944, head gasket

[tom_babbs]

Hello all,

I managed to strip the head off of my engine tonight and was surprised to see the word turbo in big letters on the top of the gasket, so first question are the gaskets different between a turbo and a n/a engine.

Next i peeled the gasket away and was surprised to see the water around the bore liners was rusty looking were all the other water that has come out of the engine has been really clean orange anti-freeze.

I stripped the engine as i have been having massive oil problems wherby i had no oil pressure at all, the oil appears to go up to the cam assembly via the bolt channels and i think this has been leaking into the water system.

Any ideas as to the cause of my problems, and why i appear to have a section of stagnent water within the engine.

All help much appreciated Tom

P.s. i will post some pictures later.

 

[Frenchy]

Tom,
The gasket will be standard for all 2.5 cars turbo and NA from the factory, unsure about the rusty coloured water in the liners, possibly contamination from the gasket itself when being removed ?
Edited to say if oil was getting in to the water it would be apparent in that the water would appear creamy/ mayonaisse like.
Jim.

 

[tom_babbs]

As promised some pictures, i have been expecting mayonaise.

 

[George Elliott]

Tom,
The block is Ali, and the majority of the water contact parts are "non-iron" so will not contribute to the rust. As mentioned above the gaskets are metal and do rot so I'd agree that may be a contributor.
Most anti freeze I am familiar with is blue /green or pink. Your engine looks normal with old water and little anti freeze to me.
Did it contain this thru the big freeze in January?
Sorry I can't be much help.
George
944t

 

[944 man]

Water short circuit due to gasket failure, perhaps? When this happens water doesnt move through all of the galleries as it should.

 

[Mike_Pollock]

Im with 944man, when I stripped my 83 engine the gasket was rusted through in several places, which allows the coolant to shortcut the areas of the block, mine wasn't quite as rusted as yours appears.
The only iron in the system is the impellor and the gasket as far as I can see.

 

[Mike_Pollock]

This was the worst hole in mine

 

[tom_babbs]

The water by-passing the galleries ties in with what i was thinking, but there dont appear to be any extra holes in the gasket.

What i mean by the anti freeze being a different colour you can see in the second picture to the left of the block and above the gasket a bright orange/pink patch, this is some of the water that had spilled out and landed on the plastic bag i put over the ends of the exhaust that where sticking up, this looks like very clean fresh anti-freeze water mix compared to the water in the block there is a massive difference in colour. All of the water that came out of the engine has been that fresh mix colour, except the stuff under the gasket.

I only bought this car a short while ago so i dont know the what has been done to it previously.

The car did not appear to get very hot in the time i have had it and i live on the Isle of Man so it has had a good spanking! I am know a bit worried by the odd connection on the water temperature sensor in the block and whether it has been giving a false happy temperature reading.

Worryingly all of the nuts and bolts that i have had to undo have been easy including the exhaust manifold and flange which are normally well tight as a result of the heat they endure over time, the inlet manifold bolts were only just past finger tight and i used a 1/4 drive socket set to undo nearly every bolt i had to undo (excluding the head bolts which i had to use my 2 foot bar in 1/2 inch drive to undo), so either porsches are a much better quality product than all of my previous old cars or the engine has been in bits not too long before i bought it!

The oil problems that prompted the head strip were a complete loss of oil pressure following a couple of days on ramps to change some brake pipes, this appeared to be fixed after i removed the oil pressure sensor and blipped the throttle and got a load of oil over the inside of the wheel, but aftertopping the oil level up and a short test drive (couple of miles) i had massively reduced oil pressure (about 1 on the guage at idle) and when i checked the dipstick it had gone from the top notch to the bottom notch, with no obvious leak under the car. I then noticed that the water level appeared to have risen to almost the top of the bottle and with the aid of a torch down the oil filler i could see mayonaise.

The mayonaise seems to have disappeared from down the filler tube but it has congealed black tarry looking substance stuck to the bottom of the tube.

Oh dear i hope i havent bought pup!

Any help greatly appreciated Tom

 

[robwright]

Tom any chance of some more pics? Some cottage cheese in the top of the oil filler is quite normal to see on 944 engines. Condensation can collect in there.

 

[Mike_Pollock]

Tom - I'd agree with Rob, your gasket looks a lot better than mine and much newer.
And also it sounds like the engine has been apart recently, exactly why would be interesting to find out!
The biggest problem bit is the oil cooler, which also houses the pressure relief valve and filter.
It has lots of seals etc and I'd be looking there with what you've said.
Good luck

 

[tom_babbs]

I am going away for a few days so i will have a look at the oil cooler when iget back, i will also take some more pics when i return.

Cheers Tom

 

[JamesO]

The oil cooler matrix can fail and cause the mixing of coolant and oil, often mistaken for a failed head gasket apparently. Last I looked the matrix was pretty steep price wise but should be cheap used.

 

[944 man]

Yes, it was an achilles heel on the series one cars...

Dont worry too much OP: the engines can be bought fit and healthy for £150, so even a worst case senario isnt too bad.