What paint system was used in 1991

bmnelsc · Jul 5, 2011

My 1991 S2 in Guards Red is showing bloom and oxidization. It had obviously been power polished when I bought it almost 3 yrs ago and needed it again this year. I took to a professional detailer and results on the hood and nose panel were less than I hoped for. Their reason being there is no clear coat left and the paint is thin - they didn't want to risk burning through it. (Oddly enough there was no concern in that regard when the estimated the job and took on the work [>:]

So - was Porsche using a clear coat on non-metallic colors in 1991? I'm thinking it was still enamel paint (maybe lacquer) for the old standard colors in those years. Anybody know for sure?

Thank you

Eldavo · Jul 6, 2011

There is no clear coat on a guards red 944.

sawood12 · Jul 6, 2011

Not on the non-metallic colours, but I guess they would have on metallic colours?

Mark Elder · Jul 6, 2011

What about 1996? Flat Black? Had not occurred to me that my car might not have a lacquer coat.

chrishak · Jul 6, 2011

The change to clear over base solid colours happened at the same time as the change to water based solid colours. At Zuffenhausen, this change started in 1992. I assume that the vehicles built at VW plants would have gone over to COB technology at the same time, if not before. Hard facts are difficult to come by, but these dates are close to accurate. The change was driven by environmental legislation. The best chance of confirming whether your car has lacquer would be to look at hidden areas under the bonnet or in the luggage compartment. If you find areas of matt colour coat, then you have a COB outer paint system, but it's not a definite indication. Best I can suggest, I'm afraid.

graham.webb · Jul 6, 2011

You probably know this, but Germany was influenced by the green lobby very early on, and one early adoption was solvent free paints. Reds appeared to suffer fading more than other cars, and it's commonly seen on VWs from the same era. Something to do with stability of the pigments? Wouldn't surprise me if the degrading goes well below the surface.

Another example, I'm afraid, of people rushing into ill thought out green solutions under political pressure!! The catalytic converter was another, but don't get me started on that.....

bmnelsc · Jul 7, 2011

Thanks to all for your inputs. I found the following "guideline" on another site and seems to hold true with my experiences (I've waxed a lot of old cars with enamel paint [

])

Take a clean white cloth, wet it with lacquer thinner and rub a spot of paint to test the reaction.
If the color comes off immediately or the spot starts wrinkling, it shows that the type of paint is enamel . If however the color wipes off onto the white cloth only after vigorous rubbing, it is a sign of lacquer paint. If nothing wipes off onto the cloth, the paint is probably urethane based. How to determine if your car is coated with clear coat.
To find out if the finish on your vehicle includes coats of clear paint over its base color, simply sand a hidden spot using 600-grit or finer sandpaper.
A white sanding residue shows that there exists a clear coat finish. A color residue shows that only a color material was used to paint the body with.

I'm believeing its single stage enamel because McGuire's cleaner wax came off red on the cloth. I'll proceed with rubbing compound and a delicate touch and hopefully I can clear up the spots without going through...

chrishak · Jul 7, 2011

ORIGINAL: graham.webb

You probably know this, but Germany was influenced by the green lobby very early on, and one early adoption was solvent free paints. Reds appeared to suffer fading more than other cars, and it's commonly seen on VWs from the same era. Something to do with stability of the pigments? Wouldn't surprise me if the degrading goes well below the surface.

Another example, I'm afraid, of people rushing into ill thought out green solutions under political pressure!! The catalytic converter was another, but don't get me started on that.....

Pre-COB red paints REALLY suffered when legislation dictated that lead should be removed from the formulation. The other colours to suffer were yellows which nowadays are all but transparent until you've applied a coat about an inch thick (a slight exageration, but you get my drift!).

Unlike much of the so-called environmental legislation, taking lead out of the paint was probably a good idea ...especially if you were a factory paint sprayer.

I second the cynical view of catalytic converters - lean burn was a far better solution.

JM1962 · Jul 7, 2011

I have been told that red pigments are organic and that is the reason they react to sunlight, unlike other colours there is no synthetic red pigment. How true this is I don't know.

944 man · Jul 9, 2011

Guards Red was a solvent paint in 1990/1991, but it was a new water based paint for the 1994 model year. This would have a laquer, so perhaps the car has been re-painted using a legal water-based paint, as opposed to a kitten-killing 2K?

Simon

simch1 · Jul 15, 2011

I'm going to get mine blown over later this year I think. Or was even thinking a vinyl wrap...

My mate paints Fer...Fer...I just cannot say it, Fezzas and he reckons I should go for Rosso which he has by the bucket load in clear over base! it's a bit "redder" than Gurds red, but not sure I could do it to the old Porker!!