Short trips

[Guest]

Firstly, hello!

Been lurking around this forum for a while and have learnt a huge amount. So, thank you to everyone who contributes!

My question, i'm thinking of taking the plunge into 964 ownership - probably sometime towards the end of the year. My only concern (and it's a minor one) is that my daily commute is only a few miles to the station. Unfortunately there isn't a bus or any alternative so i'd have to drive and the engine would barely get warmed up.

Is this a problem?

I know it's generally not advised in any car, but would it be a particular problem for a 964? Obviously come the weekend i'll be out for a nice long drive [] so it wont just be short trips.

Also, maybe someone can clear something else up for me. Is Aircon standard? Stupid question I know but I can't find an answer anywhere! All the cars i've looked at have it so up until now i've assumed it was standard.

Again, thanks for a smashing forum.

Regards,

Bilko

 

[964rh]

Bilko

I try not to use mine for short journey's, was advised not to due to excessive moisture build up in the oil and exhaust parts. Sometimes it's unavoidable but I wouldn't do it on a day to day basis, as you said the engine would hardly be warmed up. Mine takes about ten minutes to warm up on a normal day, hardly ever going over 3k rpm until it's warm.

As far as A/C being standard, a lot of UK cars have it and some don't. I think it was an option when new. Mine doesn't and wasn't an essential that I was bothered about when I bought the car.

Can be expensive to repair (ask computamedic) also. You shouldn't have to pay a premuim for it but check that it works.

Good luck and take the plunge!

Rob

 

[Guest]

I might have to investigate a longer route to the station!

Hummmm...

When I say a short trip I guess it's about 15-20 minutes max so maybe that's not too bad...maybe I could make it a bit better by taking a longer route home that would get it nicely up to temperature.

Thanks for the quick response!

As for taking the plunge, I keep having to resist the urge to go and see cars at the moment - just about to move house so it's not good timing!

 

[Andy Roe]

Why not buy the 964 & get a cheap run about for <£1000 for the trips to the station? It'll probably end up saving you money in fuel & you'd probably be able to insure the 964 on a classic policy for a lot less & you'll not have to leave the 964 parked in a station car park each day!!

Either way, take the plunge -- if you buy when your heads in control & not your heart & have an inspection done by a mechanic who knows 964's so you can make sure you get a gooden', then you'll never look back!!

Good Luck!

Andy

PS. Remember, don't buy on mileage or colour, but buy on the cars overall condition!

 

[kevin]

I agree with Andy's comments, mainly as that's what I do, then insure the 964 on a classic policy.

I have an old Audi 80.....owned for 10 years, 193k on her and its what allows me to run the 964 at weekends andthe odd excuriosn to Le mans


kevin

 

[Guest]

Hi Bilko,

Air con WAS an option back in the 964 days, as you say, some have some don't. I've had loads of cars with a/c and my 964 does have it but I hardly use it!!! This gives me a good excuse to open both windows and listen to the flat 6 harmonise with the atmosphere []

The option for a/c was listed as "573" on the white label under the front bonnet (or in the original Maintenance Manual). All the options are listed on this 'label' and are normally groups of 3 numbers. The a/c can be retro fitted but I have no idea how much this would cost !!!

I don't think 15-20 mins is too bad but what Rob says is very true. I don't worry too much - certainly not enough to stop me having the 'perfect' car. I work from home and have another vehicle to do most of the work so you're better off than me to travel every day.

Good luck with the purchase....timing re moving home? Well, as soon as I got my 964 after dreaming for 30 yrs, my wife announced we are having another baby...aint life fun []

Cat

 

[Guest]

I'm definately having a PPI. I can't afford not to!

As for the run about, that is something i've considered. But as my 964 budget (probably around £16k) is tight for a decent one anyway I can't really afford it in the short term.

I should point out that the £16k is a conservative budget, i've got some additional funds for servicing etc.

As for the station car park, fortunately it's a very quiet station that i'm not too concerned about parking at.

I think i'm going to be worried wherever I leave the car, i'm going to have to get used to it! Just hope some idiot chav doesn't pour paint stipper over it (if you've read this month's total 911 you'll know what i'm talking about!).

The one thing that I really can't decide on is C2 / C4. My head says, "You're less likely to have a bad experience with a bush in a C4".

But my heart just - well, doesn't say anything really, just throbs slightly more at the prospect of a C2.

I think when it comes down to it, I will, as you rightly say, buy on condition and not worry too much about it being a C2 or a C4.

Mileage doesn't worry me either, infact in some ways i'd rather have a car with a higher mileage, at least you know it's been driven!

Thanks for the responses.

 

[Guest]

ORIGINAL: Screamincat


Good luck with the purchase....timing re moving home? Well, as soon as I got my 964 after dreaming for 30 yrs, my wife announced we are having another baby...aint life fun []

Cat

Don't say things like that! I'll be waking up in a cold sweat tonight.

 

[mbrands]

Re C2 or C4, the C2 is a lighter car than the C4. On the 964 the difference is quite noticeable. While in an extreme situation, you might be less likely to end up in a bush if you have a C4, on an every day basis I found the C2 significantly more fun to drive because it felt more nimble and responsive than the C4.

This is only one opinion though, and I'm sure many will beg to differ, so all I can say is make sure you drive them both before you buy, then you can make up your own mind whether it matters much to you.

 

[Guest]

ORIGINAL: mbrands

Re C2 or C4, the C2 is a lighter car than the C4. On the 964 the difference is quite noticeable. While in an extreme situation, you might be less likely to end up in a bush if you have a C4, on an every day basis I found the C2 significantly more fun to drive because it felt more nimble and responsive than the C4.

This is only one opinion though, and I'm sure many will beg to differ, so all I can say is make sure you drive them both before you buy, then you can make up your own mind whether it matters much to you.

I have to admit the purest in me does long for a C2. I would also like to take it on the (very, very occasional) track day...or the 'ring, which again i'm sure some would argue a C2 would be better for - although it's important to remember that 99% of the driving I do will be on road!

The thing that concerns me about a C2 is the predictability of it in wet or icy conditions.

Obviously you have to treat the car with respect, and if you do you'll probably be fine...but it is a concern. Although to be fair, that goes for pretty much any car, well in icy conditions anyway.

At the moment I have a 2.0 Alfa 147, which I drive much harder than I should at times - I think the 964 will be a bit of a wake up call and quite a culture shock!

Needless to say, I can't wait!

 

[Dave Wilkinson]

Bilko,

I think everybody is of the same opinion about the short trips. A good 10-15 minutes is needed for the oil to get to working temperature and shorter distances tend to leave water vapour in the exhaust, which just accelerates the rust.

As has already been said, the aircon was an option and you'll find many cars without it. Personally I wouldn't buy a car without it - but that's just a personal taste. If you DO find a car with a/c you should make sure it's functional. Don't get fobbed off with the old "it just needs re-gassing" routine. If that's the excuse get the seller to re-gas it and demonstrate that it works. As Rob said - I've been there and done it!! My evaporator expired on me and cost the best part of £1000 to fix. The whole heating and air con system in the 964 is complex due to the amount of electronics involved including the main controller (£1200), rear blower (£200), 5 servos, 2 internal blowers as well as the a/c compressor, evaporator, condensor, receiver/dryer and expansion valve.

If you buy a car without aircon and contemplate retro-fitting it - don't bother. It's far cheaper to sell what you have and buy another car with it already fitted.

Just to add insult to injury, the aircon on the 964 isn't a great performer - particularly if it's been upgraded to R134a. It WILL blow cool air, as long as the weather isn't TOO hot. Don't get me wrong, I'd rather have it than not, but don't expect brass monkey temperatures.

Good luck with your search - there are some good ones out there. I'd recommend a LHD car if you want a good deal. IMHO they have a better driving position and you can live with the downsides unless you spend your time going through car park barriers.

Regards

Dave

 

[964rh]

ORIGINAL: Bilko

ORIGINAL: mbrands


Obviously you have to treat the car with respect, and if you do you'll probably be fine...but it is a concern. Although to be fair, that goes for pretty much any car, well in icy conditions anyway.

At the moment I have a 2.0 Alfa 147, which I drive much harder than I should at times - I think the 964 will be a bit of a wake up call and quite a culture shock!

Needless to say, I can't wait!

To tell you the truth Bilko, my C4 scared the living S**T out of me when I first drove in the wet and sometimes still does. In my experience it may be more surefooted in the wet than the C2 when driven not so hard but when your pushing it you will lose it unless you know how to drive like a god. Unfortunately, I am not a god!!
When I was looking for my car and wasn't biase towards a C2 or C4, just bought the best one I could in the condition I wanted. I don't regret buying the C4, it does more than enough for me.

Rob

 

[Guest]

ORIGINAL: Computamedic


As has already been said, the aircon was an option and you'll find many cars without it. Personally I wouldn't buy a car without it - but that's just a personal taste. If you DO find a car with a/c you should make sure it's functional. Don't get fobbed off with the old "it just needs re-gassing" routine. If that's the excuse get the seller to re-gas it and demonstrate that it works. As Rob said - I've been there and done it!! My evaporator expired on me and cost the best part of £1000 to fix. The whole heating and air con system in the 964 is complex due to the amount of electronics involved including the main controller (£1200), rear blower (£200), 5 servos, 2 internal blowers as well as the a/c compressor, evaporator, condensor, receiver/dryer and expansion valve.


Just to add insult to injury, the aircon on the 964 isn't a great performer - particularly if it's been upgraded to R134a. It WILL blow cool air, as long as the weather isn't TOO hot. Don't get me wrong, I'd rather have it than not, but don't expect brass monkey temperatures.

I think I agree with you about the aircon - I would rather have it and will probably wait for a car that does. The only other thing i'm bothered about (i'm going to get flamed for this) is that it's not white!

Sorry, don't like white whatever the car.

ORIGINAL: Rob Hounslow

To tell you the truth Bilko, my C4 scared the living S**T out of me when I first drove in the wet and sometimes still does. In my experience it may be more surefooted in the wet than the C2 when driven not so hard but when your pushing it you will lose it unless you know how to drive like a god.

You see, it's comments like that which push me towards a C4! Surely a C2 can only be worse (or better depending on your attitude!).

I think the answer is to just buy on condition. I'll wait for a good one to come along, if it's a C4 great, if it's a C2 great - might just have to keep a spare pair of underwear handy.

Is there a quick way to tell if a car has aircon? Is there an obvious button on the dash or something? The typical ice crystal symbol I guess? Or maybe not....!

Thanks again all.

 

[Dave Wilkinson]

ORIGINAL: Bilko

Is there a quick way to tell if a car has aircon? Is there an obvious button on the dash or something? The typical ice crystal symbol I guess? Or maybe not....!

Bilko,

The most obvious sign is the compressor sitting on top right of the engine. If the car doesn't have a/c there is nothing there (and often a third belt pulley on the crankshaft with no belt.)

Regards

Dave

 

[mbrands]

Definitely buy on condition, but don't be intimidated by a C2. No sense in rejecting it out of hand until you've at least tried one and compared it to a C4. The C4 is a good car, but personally, I found the steering on the C2 to be less heavy and the overall response slightly crisper. Besides, the C2 is not exactly a deathtrap and you'd soon get the hang of the driving dynamics, as thousands of other people have before you. And on good tyres (Pirelli or Bridgestones please, don't know Michelins, don't like Continentals) you will be fine in the rain.

In icey conditions I don't think it matters too much either, because unless you fit winter tyres, you had better tiptoe around very carefully, because on standard low profile tyres you will be sliding plenty regardless of whether you have a C2 or a C4.[]

Anyway, I'm not sure why I'm trying to talk you into a C2... just get a car you like and enjoy it, is what matters. Good luck in your quest.

 

[Melv]

I can assure you, in the long run it will be cheaper to buy a 964 and a cheap runabout.
i.e. some insurance companies will only insure a Porsche as a second car.

Sue used to commute thirty miles per day in traffic in our 964C4. After a year we did the sums and worked out it was cheaper to get a Ford Ka on Ford's Options programme over two years and keep the 964 for weekends than to run the C4 on it's own i.e. C4 18mpg, Ka 40mpg for starters.....

However, the car was sold to a young lady in Scotland (high Debs!) as her daily user summer and winter. But by then a lot of the glitches and repairs, particularly on the electrical and aircon side had been sorted, at my expense!

 

[Guest]

Hi & welcome,

Firstly I drive mine on short runs every day as my journey to work is only 2 miles never had any problems but I do run it longer on the weekends if I get the chance. With regard to A/C mine has not got it as she is a 2 it is more common on the 4 but its still not that good and is very very expensive to repair, also don't buy an early 4 (1989) just to get the A/C as the early 4's were a problem, my advice is forgot the A/C issue unless you really need it and if so buy a 993.

Hope this helps

Pete[]
--------------------------
1991 964 Guards Red Tip
1987 944s White ( For Sale)

 

[Guest]

Hi Bilko, and welcome to the forum

Re C2 or C4, the C2 is a lighter car than the C4. On the 964 the difference is quite noticeable. While in an extreme situation, you might be less likely to end up in a bush if you have a C4, on an every day basis I found the C2 significantly more fun to drive because it felt more nimble and responsive than the C4.

I agree with this totally and would advise some test drives in both. I searched for a while before finding my car and found that the C2's always seemed to have the better steering, and felt more like I expected them to. I have had a couple of "moments" in mine in bad conditions, but to be honest it was more about lack of driving ability than being a C2 - It probably would have too fast for the same conditions in a C4.

As for the air-con - I wouldn't go out specifcally looking for it, just judge on condition and history. I find that I prefer to have the windows open most of the time, and the sound-track is part of the ownership joy.

I don't think you'll have any problems with your short drive to the station. My car is often used as a daily driver for a similar journey and I've never experienced any snags caused by that type of use. I certainly wouldn't buy another car as a run-around as I believe the best ownership satisfaction comes from using it daily, and enjoying it more often. It's always seemed like a lot of money to spend on a weekend toy, especially when a 964 is one of the most usable cars in this category/class/expense. Buying a run around could save you money but you're not buying a 964 to save money are you?!?

Good luck with your search. You'll not regret it!

Regards

Steve

 

[Guest]

I would prefer a car with Aircon, but it isn't essential. I certainly wouldn't forsake an otherwise perfect car for one with aircon.

Looks like the answer re:c2/c4, is to just do lots of test drives. This is a hardship that I will have to bare. I won't complain, i'll take it like a man. Well, like a man with a smile on his face that is.

Thanks again for the responses.

Bilko. []