KW 3 spring rates?

[JarmoL]

Hi there,

What kind of spring rates people here are running with their KW's? In Germany they seem to be selling so called "Nurburgring" setup.. does anyone know what kind of spring rates those come with? I guess I am just wondering if the Nring setup might be too soft for a regular race track?

Jarmo

 

[lali]

The only thing i could find is this from the 968 forum....

General Suspension Settings for Porsche 968 with 17" wheel & road tyre.
CAMBER
Road & Track
Front -1.5 deg
Rear -1.0 deg
Track Only
Front -2.5 deg
Rear -2.0 deg
CASTOR
Set to max available "" up to 9 deg
RIDE HEIGHT
Set to max lowering for track use as per instruction in fitting guide.
Measuring from centre of wheel vertically to the wheel arch, the minimum measured distance should be as follows:
Front "" 310mm
Rear "" 330mm

Coilover Settings for KW Variant 3
BUMP ADJUSTMENT "" TRACK USE
Front "" ½ turn open (from fully closed).
Rear "" ¼ / ½ turn open (from fully closed).
REBOUND ADJUSTMENT "" TRACK USE
Front "" 1 turn open (from fully closed).
Rear "" 1 ½ turns open (from fully closed).
BUMP & REBOUND FOR ROAD USE
Front + Rear "" open all ¼ to ½ turn more than for track.
The spring rates for the KW 968 Variant 3 are as follows:
Front Axle
Helper = 20 N/mm
Main = 60 N/mm
Rear Axle
Helper = 10 N/mm
Main = 50 N/mm


Hope it helps....

 

[sawood12]

I think these settings are for Stuarts 968 which has the smaller dia torsion bar i.e. the same as the 944 S2 and the early 944 turbo's. The later turbo's and M030 turbo's had the larger dia and stiffer torsion bars fitted so you might want less stiff springs on the rear.

 

[Fen]

At Oulton I actually went with Big Dave's settings which were slightly more aggressive and it was fantastic. I don't know if they publish the spring rates, because they are part of the Variant 3 package. Nurburgring settings are probably more to do with the geometry and bump/rebound than the spring rates I'd guess.

 

[333pg333]

Fen do you remember what those settings were? I have gone with settings advised by KW as a starting point. This was done by my mechanic after talking with our local KW agent so I'm slightly out of the loop and I may need/want to change to a firmer setting in the future.

 

[Fen]

I don't to be honest, but Big Dave will probably be along later and can tell you himself. Of course they may not work the same on your race setup.

 

[Big Dave]

AS far as i know the standard springs supplied in the "kit" are ...
Fr,, 60N/mm or 335lbs/inch
Rear,, 50N/mm or 279lbs/inch..
The helpers are as stated in lalis post...

BUT ive fitted stronger springs in my set up...
Fr.. 80N/mm,,,447 lbs
Rear 70N/mm,, 391lbs...

I personally wouldnt go any stiffer than this "now" as i find it a bit uncomfy on the road...BUT,, its fantastic on track..[][][]Also after speaking to a VERY well respected + "seasoned" race car preparer. He recomends this as the strongest spring to fit to a S2 or otherwise....
Also these are THE stiffest that is recomended by KW testers for the V3 "standard" kit , unless its valving rates are changed at the factory....

Bump + rebound i set at HALF a turn OPEN from FULLY closed...Its easy to remember it that way...

 

[Diver944]

ORIGINAL: Big Dave UK

BUT ive fitted stronger springs in my set up...
Fr.. 80N/mm,,,447 lbs
Rear 70N/mm,, 391lbs...

WOWSA [8D]

No wonder it handles so well on track. Do you turn the shocks to full soft when driving to and from the track, and does it make any appreciable difference? I wonder how those rates compare with standard suspension 911 track cars (964RS, 993RS, GT3 etc)

 

[333pg333]

Well I guess there's a difference between the Varient 3 and the 2 way race, but my rates are 110n / 615 lb/in front and 50n 708 lb/in rear in combination with my bigger 25.5 torsion bar. At the moment they are closer to a race setup but the ride quality is definitely more compliant than my old Mo30 / 968cs setup which I can't quite figure out as these springs have definitely a higher rate. It must all be in the valving? I'm not even going to change these settings I have now to anything softer for the road although I may go stiffer for the track. Oh and on the track they're fantastic!

 

[Big Dave]

Paul.
Yes i return the adjusters to fully soft for the road...

 

[JarmoL]

Hi there,

Great info, thanks alot! Need to count my pennies now..

Jarmo

 

[Rich Sandor]

Big Dave, what is the part number for the replacement springs, and where did you get them from?

I want to get the same 80N/m springs you have up front, but I want to go with a 90N/m in back (deleting the torsion bars, reinforcing the rear strut mount)

Please & Thanks!
-Rich

 

[Big Dave]

Rich. I got them from Demon Tweeks.
Ill have a look for my reciept + let you know the part no,s....

 

[Rich Sandor]

Wow thanks for the quick reply Dave!!

 

[Big Dave]

Rich. i think the ones i fitted were,,
[I couldnt find the reciept, ive got it "somewhere".. Just not handy...[8|][8|]]
The following are the part no,s from the DT catalogue..

Fronts. Part no,,60110077 ,, 200mm free length,80N/mm-447lbs. These are longer than the standard springs aswell, as i thought they looked to be "sat too high on the collars"..
Rears. Part no,,60110023 ,,140mm free length, 70N/mm - 391lbs.
These work WONDERFULLY...[][][]

 

[333pg333]

Rich, I'd be interested in seeing how you reinforce the rear shock mounts. Take some pics if you can. I am looking at doing a track car and would go with Torsion bar delete also.
Dave, I want to go up in spring rates on my Grey car. Do you think there is any reason to increase the torsion bar in concert with the upgraded coilover or would you think it's fine just to upgrade the coils? What sort of jump up would you think is safe? I don't want to go crazy but I also don't want to be too conservative if I'm going to bother with doing this.
Patrick

 

[Big Dave]

Idev thought just doing the coils would be OK...
The spring rates , i couldnt help with, i got my info direct from the "Nurburgring" guru of KW...I think he was called Klause....
I was told that the rates i fitted were the stiffest i could safely go to without damaging the internal valving...Otherwise itd overheat the valves , as the springs reacted faster being stiffer....

 

[333pg333]

I am thinking my 2 way race would be valved differently to the stock V3s?

 

[Rich Sandor]

Thanks again Dave. I agree that going too stiff w/ springs on a V3 setup in not good. Everybody tells me they are designed to run softer springs with stiffer valving, and not intended for ultra stiff springs. That said my buddy ran his 944 turbo with the stock V3 setup, and with sticky tyres he gets way too much body roll for my tastes.

Patrick, your two-way race should be safe with the stiffer springs.

I will post some pics of the reinforced top strut mounts when I actually do them. I just absolutely hate the pain-in-the-butt labour-intensive complexity of adjusting the torsion bars and can't wait to get rid of them!

 

[333pg333]

Rich, I've done a little digging around on the T bar delete option and the consensus is that on a lighter car you don't need to run as hard a spring and virtually everyone who has removed the T bars have not had any issues with the mounts. So for what it's worth don't go crazy on that job.