Brake Upgrade

[blease]

I have searched on this forum for info on brake upgrades but got no returns. Forgive me if this has been detailed before but I am looking for information to help decide between Big Red/Black brake upgrade versus Boxster brake upgrade for a 944 S2 track day car. Any done either and if so what were the costs and improvements noted?

 

[sulzeruk]

Get some M030 front calipers and disks, all you will need, better to lose weight out of the car rather than put monster brakes on it! Alasdair

 

[Neil Haughey]

Agree with above but the easiest upgrade for an S2 is to either fit the 968 duct kit (deflector for wishbone and cowling that fits on strut), or better still fit ducts where the fog lights go and run ducting through the arch to sit on the steering knuckle so the cool air is directed straight at the disk. The first mod is just making an S2 a little more like a 968 but the 2nd approach is more extensive and is what all the S2 race cars prepared by EMC run. So far I have had no brake problems on my race car like this running stock disks, calipers, ATE blue fluid and uprated pads. On the national straight at Silverstone for example you don't even touch the peddle until next to the red and white kerbing on the outside, the car could stop faster with M030 calipers but a lightweight car doesn't have to have them.

 

[sawood12]

Boxster brakes. They are lighter than Big Reds/Big Blacks and M030 medium blacks. You'll need an adapter kit for any of these. You should be able to get away with non S brakes - though you'll probably need to go to 17" rims. Though if you're talking a dedicated stripped out and lightened track day car then standard S2 'little black' brakes are more than adequate assuming they are in fine working order with no plate lift, fresh and decent DOT 4 fluid and ideally some ducting (968 style scoops seem to be quite cheap). The problem with M030 medium black calipers is that they are difficult to find and will cost you as much as Boxster brakes for a pair of tatty calipers with plate lift in need of a good and expensive refurbishment.

 

[chrisg]

Hiya, having run a standard (non-lightened) S2 for several years and now an M030 Turbo, my advice would be ensure you existing brakes are in good nick - as previously, no plate lift, fresh uprated fluid Racing Blue or AP 600, braided hoses and decent pads = M1155 or similar. Unless you're running very sticky tires and/or over use the brakes, this set up should be plenty powerful for track work. One thing you never hear people say is " Porsche always under engineer their brakes...."

 

[Big Dave]

ORIGINAL: Neil Haughey Agree with above but the easiest upgrade for an S2 is to either fit the 968 duct kit (deflector for wishbone and cowling that fits on strut)

Yes thats correct Neil, Only snag is youl need 968 wishbones to attatch the lower deflector too. The 944 ones dont have the 2 small alloy lugs in place to bolt the deflector too. So it starts to get costly.... Best option is to find a set on the M030 / Turbo /928S4 callipers + discs.

 

[Neil Haughey]

Very true Dave, I was lucky in that my car had had one of the wishbones replaced by an OPC about 11 years back with a new 968 one, I then exchanged the other to get a pair. I believe some of the guys stateside have made up adapters to mount the deflector on the wishbone. Anyways it wouldn't surprise if a few ppl out there already have 968 wishbones on their S2's or late turbos.

 

[blease]

Very helpful comments chaps...many thanks. I will persevere with stock for now and look into improving cooling as suggested. Car is a bit lighter than standard. Stripped sound deadening and bucket seats should lose me a few kilos!

 

[os951]

996 GT3 6-piston front Monoblocks and 4-piston rears with these

 

[appletonn]

ORIGINAL: os951 996 GT3 6-piston front Monoblocks and 4-piston rears with these

Yet more engineering porn from our friend Olli! Love the apparent quality of all of these parts of yours Olli. My old heavy hector '44 turbo was fine on track with Medium blacks (no plate lift!), Super Blue fluid, braided hoses and a retrofit of the original ducting from front valance to wheel well only (not fitted to later turbos) and decent Porterfield pads. Always had firm pedal and decent bite with no sign of fade even at Donnington. Never as good as the brakes on my old 'beetle' mind you, but I'd blame the LHD/RHD brake linkage arrangement for that.

 

[edh]

030 brakes sound like a good idea - fit under 16's etc.. but you need the hubs, calipers & discs so works out expensive. We all agree I think - cooling (number 1 top mod & v cheap) and then pads. If they make them for your caliper, try some performance friction PFC 97's. They were way better than 1155's (although twice the price) in my turbo. Even ChrisG commented on my late braking - and he doesn't scare easily.... []

 

[Peter Empson]

I have 944T calipers on my car, run Castrol SRF with Porterfield R4-S pads and the combination is easily sufficient for my needs (even without extra cooling). However I would recommend just trying a serious pad/fluid upgrade before spending money on major changes. The Porterfields are cheaper than Performance Friction but I believe very similar (same tech etc - I will be back to back testing them soon to settle this debate), buy direct from the States for the best prices (either from EBS or through eBay etc).

 

[Tam Lin]

ORIGINAL: sawood12 Boxster brakes. They are lighter than Big Reds/Big Blacks and M030 medium blacks. You'll need an adapter kit for any of these.

Anyone know of a supplier for the Boxster adapter kit? I've been thinking about this swap for my 924S. Currently I run Wilwoods up front and 951 Little Blacks on the back, with the 968 scoop on early 951 front A-arms, and although I've never had problems on track, the fronts do get very grumbly on the Autobahn, where frequent stops from 120 Mph are the order of the day.

 

[os951]

I know who can supply such a kit, but i would not go into Boxster setup, just too small. Consider MK I 996 Turbo or GT3 units if you would like to use 4-piston calipers.

 

[sawood12]

Boxster setup is a good replacement for standard brakes assuming you don't want to go bigger. Going bigger is fine if you need it or want the aesthetics, but if you're after a standard replacement and reducing unsprung weight then the Boxster non-S set up is a good replacement for standard 944T/S2 brakes. Not sure where you get the adaptors from (other than Oli), but only needs appropriate adaptors. No need to replace rears (again unless you want to for the sheer hell of it).

 

[zcacogp]

ORIGINAL: os951 996 GT3 6-piston front Monoblocks and 4-piston rears with these

... for the full-on "I've hit a brick wall' braking experience, no doubt? Seriously nice looking kit there, as usual Olli! Oli.