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daro911

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Porsche 911 3.8 Turbo

Test date Monday, October 12, 2009 Price as tested TBA


New 911 Turbo is designed to be more entertaining

The new Porsche 911 Turbo. Unveiled in at last month's Frankfurt motor show, the latest evolution of Zuffenhausen's uber coupe/cabriolet has been extensively reworked in a two year program that Porsche's head of passenger car development, August Achleitner, claims has made it an even better and more entertaining car to drive then ever before.

Given the adrenalin inducing appeal of the old 911 Turbo "" a car we described as the best all weather supercar of all time not all that long ago, it is hard to believe such a thing is possible at all. Still, it would be very out of character for Porsche to unleash a new model that didn't, in some little way at least, improve on the one it replaces.

Not that it's reflected in the styling. Tweaks include new titanium-coloured louvers in the front side air ducts, LED daytime driving lamps residing in the place previously taken up by the fog lamps, revised exterior mirrors with a new double arm design, altered tail lamp graphics with LEDs as well as larger tail pipes poking out through the rear valance.

The old but mightily effective multi-point fuel injected 3.6-litre flat six-cylinder petrol engine with its twin variable vane turbochargers, relatively low 9.0:1 compression ratio and split deck design has been resigned to history.

It's replaced by a more powerful direct-injected 3.8-litre version of Porsche's classic flat six-cylinder running newly reworked twin variable vane turbochargers, higher 9.8:1 compression ratio and closed deck architecture which is claimed to boost rigidity. In doing so, peak power climbs from 473bhp to 493bhp at 6000rpm while torque has increased from an already hugely potent 630Nm in the outgoing engine to 650Nm between 1950 and 5000rpm.

Along with the new engine, there's also a new optional gearbox in the form of a new seven-speed PDK gearbox. Fitted to the car we drove, it replaces the Mercedes-Benz produced five speed automatic offered on the old 911 Turbo.

What's it like?

Mind blowing. The bare performance figures - 0-to-62mph in 3.4sec, 0-to-100mph in 7.0sec and 193mph top speed - hint at something very special and better its predecessor in each case. But the way the 911 Turbo goes about its business almost defies conventional road car logic.

You'd likely find a more powerful and faster car over a wide and smooth surfaced race track. But on normal roads "" the sort you and I encounter every day with varying surfaces, odd cambers and all variety of hidden surprises like those served up at the car's launch in Portugal this week, I seriously doubt any rival "" not even a Bugatti Veyron, Ferrari Enzo or Porsche Carrera GT - would come close to matching it for sheer pace or outright dynamic prowess for any length of time.

See the hi-res pictures of the new 911 Turbo

It is the engine, more than anything else, that stands out. Hard as it may be to image given the sort of power it develops, there is no discernable turbo lag at all. Owing to the increased capacity and higher compression ratio, Porsche has actually decided to dial back boost pressure a touch, from a previous 1.0 to a nominal 0.8 bar, in the interests of added driveability. The result is even keener throttle response and a level of flexibility you really have to experience to believe.

The weight has been trimmed by 25kg in models with the new dual clutch gearbox over those running the old automatic to an impressive 1595kg, giving it a power-to-weight ratio of 309bhp/tonne.

When the road is straight, you're treated to typically solid and high speed stability, albeit with some characteristic bobbing at the front end as lift forces begin the build. More remarkable that this, however, is the speed at which the dual clutch gearbox manages to pick off the gears without any interruption in acceleration despite having to cope with all that torque.

The steering wheel mounted paddles are nicely weighted, positive in action and enhanced by a Sport Plus function, which lights up on the left-hand spoke of the steering wheel, to signal a remapping of the throttle for an even more aggressive throttle response. As well as making it faster, another one of Porsche's primary aims with the new 911 Turbo was to make it more entertaining.

It's certainly gained in terms of overall agility, feeling less reliant upon the four wheel drive system for grip and more accommodating to sudden changes in direction. With the optional torque vectoring automatically braking the inside rear wheel, there's a new found willingness upon turn in as well as a noticeable increase in the amount of speed you can confidently carry through corners. On normal roads the handling is virtually vice-free, with so much grip you'll never feel the need to turn off the ESP.

However, as devastatingly good as the 911 Turbo is, it can sometimes come across as lacking a certain something. I'm opposed to calling it clinical , but in certain respects that's exactly what it is, if only because of the way it is able to conquer every thing you throw at it with such crushing authority.

While superbly damped and wonderfully direct, the speed sensitive variable rate steering is also a little short on ultimate feel. Compared to lesser, rear wheel drive versions of the 911, there's clearly less being communicated from the front end.

Should I buy one?

There are more spectacular looking, faster and better sounding supercars for the money. But as an everyday proposition the new 911 Turbo is just about beyond comparison.

Greg Kable
First drive data
How much?
Price as tested TBA
Price as tested TBA
How fast?
0-62 mph 3.4 sec
Max speed 194 mph
How big?
Weight no data
How thirsty?
Combined 24.1 mpg
CO2 emissions no data
Engine
Layout no data
Max power 493 bhp
Max torque no data
 
So no one is worried about coking of the valves - a common DFI problem? It already seems to have affected the new DFI Cayennes.

http://www.planetporsche.net/cayman-boxster-chat/32256-maybe-dfi-not-good-buy.html
 
Was it not found that the coking of the valves were down to low rated petrol being used?

garyw
 

ORIGINAL: garyw

Was it not found that the coking of the valves were down to low rated petrol being used?

garyw

Quite a few DFI owners are blaming Shell V Power for the soot and using BP instead.



.

 
ORIGINAL: Nicks


ORIGINAL: garyw
Was it not found that the coking of the valves were down to low rated petrol being used?
garyw
Quite a few DFI owners are blaming Shell V Power for the soot and using BP instead.

Source of that info? I think they probably need to give it some more revolutions per minute - especially the Cayennes on the school run[:D] Those photos of the valves show the "coking" up to be on the intake valves? As the fuel is injected directly into the cylinder how does the fuel cause this build up on the valve stem? More likely oil I would have thought (leaky seals) which is not being washed off by the fuel going into the cylinder via the valve?
 

ORIGINAL: tscaptain

ORIGINAL: Nicks


ORIGINAL: garyw
Was it not found that the coking of the valves were down to low rated petrol being used?
garyw
Quite a few DFI owners are blaming Shell V Power for the soot and using BP instead.

Source of that info?  I think they probably need to give it some more revolutions per minute - especially the Cayennes on the school run[:D]  Those photos of the valves show the "coking" up to be on the intake valves?  As the fuel is injected directly into the cylinder how does the fuel cause this build up on the valve stem?  More likely oil I would have thought (leaky seals) which is not being washed off by the fuel going into the cylinder via the valve?

Precisely

From the website

'Direct injection engines attempt to deliver a richer mixture of air:fuel to the combustion chamber but in a small cloud centered around the spark plug.....................A side effect is some of the cloud and some exhaust gases can flow back into the intake ports and leave deposits on the intake valves. Since fuel injectors are no longer spraying fuel on these surfaces there's nothing to wash these deposits off'
 
And this from the Porsche website which doesn't quite tally with the other
The spray and cone angles have been optimised for torque, power output, fuel consumption and emissions by enabling a homogeneous distribution of the air/fuel mixture, and, therefore, effective combustion. With direct injection, the EMS SDI 3.1 engine control regulates injection timing individually for each cylinder as well as the injection rate for each cylinder bank. This optimises the combustion process and fuel economy. A hot-film air mass meter takes care of the airflow, so that the combustion chambers contain exactly the right mixture at all times.
I think the words "homogeneous distribution" and "exactly the right mixture" are interesting.
That other long post also talks about the way cars are driven hence my earlier comment about giving it some more welly![:D] Time will tell![;)]
 
I think the key point is that the fuel is no longer washing debris and cooling the back of the valves, so they are prone to 'coking'. Giving it welly is part of the solution, but it seems to be an inherent design flaw which has similiarly manifested itself in many previous DFI'd engines.
 
Interesting. Is US V-Power the same as ours, I wonder? Doing a bit of research it seems the US stuff is 91-93 octane compared to our 99. The US stuff appears to have a "nitrogen" additive which the Euro version does not. So it would appear we have an apples and pears situation? I get some small amount of "soot" around the tips of the exhaust but no more than on the Gen 1. It's all gone after a track day![:D]
 
911 TURBO BEATS PREVIOUS 'RING RECORD
Latest 997 Turbo ups its game at the Nordschleife


[FONT=verdana,geneva"]The recent facelift to Porsche's 997 Turbo seems to have paid dividends, at least as far as track pace is concerned. The car has recorded a lap time of seven minutes 39 seconds, a full 10 seconds faster than the previous version. [FONT=verdana,geneva"] [FONT=verdana,geneva"]
Having an extra 20bhp at its disposal will certainly have helped, achieved by boring out the engine by 200cc to 3.8-litres. The 500bhp and 516lb ft of torque on tap are also now sent through a seven-speed PDK dual-clutch 'box, which is a full 25kg lighter than the previous tiptronic auto.


[FONT=verdana,geneva"]Despite these significant improvements, the 'boggo' Nissan GT-R's best recorded lap time is still 13 seconds faster than the new 911 Turbo at 7:26. But 'Ring times are not an exact science, and things can change. When the GT-R came out, the best known time was 7:38, and it took many more attempts to get the stunning time eventually achieved, so with time the Porsche may be pushed that bit further too. [FONT=verdana,geneva"] [FONT=verdana,geneva"]
Considering that the new Porsche still costs nearly twice as much as the humble Nissan, Porsche's PR team will certainly be hoping so...
Author: SimonSaid[FONT=verdana,geneva"]
 
ORIGINAL: oliver

Seems to confirm the predictions that the new Gen 2 TT will be better than ever.

First Drive
2210993321763356x236.jpg



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[FONT=verdana,geneva"][FONT=verdana,geneva"]Porsche 911 Turbo Cabriolet
Test date Tuesday, October 20, 2009 Price as tested TBA


22109933213719234x155.jpg


The cabrio Turbo is now almost as focused as the coupe[FONT=verdana,geneva"]What is it?
The 911 Turbo has just undergone a major series of revisions, including the fitment of a brand new direct injection 3.8-litre flat six engine that produces 500bhp and 479lb ft of torque.

And, if anything, the cabrio has benefited more from these revisions than the fixed head, especially if you go for the optional Sports Chrono Pack, which brings superior engine mounts compared with the non-Sports Chrono version.

By its own admission, Porsche has put much more engineering effort into making a true sports car out of the cabrio this time round. In the opinion of test guru Walter Rohl, you notice the new Turbo's improved chassis "more in the cabrio than you do in the coupe, because last time the cabrio was quite soft and, for me, there was too much movement in the car. With the new Sports Chrono engine mounts it's much better. It's almost as good as the coupe, in fact. And even without them it's very good."

The price has risen slightly from £106,359 to £109,048 in so-called basic trim. Considering you get eight per cent more acceleration, 16 per cent better economy and emissions have been reduced by 18 per cent, it's not a giant leap financially by Porsche's standards.
What's it like?
About 150 times better to drive than the previous model, no, make that 200. Although it may take a certain type of person to go for the cabrio version of the 911 Turbo, this is now a very capable sports car indeed. One that rides, steers, stops and handles with almost the same eye-watering precision as the coupe. Which is saying something.

If you were blindfolded and rode as a passenger in both, apart from the slight extra noise generated by the hood you'd have a real job to tell the open Turbo from the closed one. It's that sharp, that free from the usual soft top compromises.

Even the weight only goes up by 75kg, which is impressive considering how much extra strengthening there is to keep the bodyshell as stiff as it is. As a result performance suffers so little, you'd need a stop watch to tell the difference.

Zero to 62mph takes just 0.2sec longer than in the coupe (3.7sec with the six speed manual gearbox, 3.6sec with the seven speed PDK) and the top speed is exactly the same at 193mph, purely because it is limited by the gearing.

On the road the Turbo cabrio is now a proper weapon, especially when fitted with the new PDK transmission (£2552) and paddle shifters (£271). Yet it also rides with quite astonishing refinement considering how crisp the chassis is, and as for the grip and traction it produces, put it this way, you better make sure your toupe is well and truly glued in place.

Otherwise it'll be torn clean off your pate at the merest whiff of full throttle out of a tight corner. Not that the cabin suffers from much buffeting at all with the hood down below three figures.
Should I buy one?
If you were the sort of person who liked and could afford the previous 911 Turbo cabrio, you might be a little shocked by how much better the new one is to drive.

And seeing as how it's less than three per cent more expensive, you might even quite like the price. Be in no doubt, the 911 Turbo cabrio is no longer just a pose-mobile. It's become a very serious sports car indeed.
Steve Sutcliffe

First drive data


How much?

Price as tested TBA
Price as tested £109,048[/LIST]
How fast?

0-62 mph 3.8 sec
Max speed 193 mph[/LIST][FONT=verdana,geneva"]
How big?

Weight no data[/LIST]
How thirsty?

Combined no data
CO2 emissions no data[/LIST][FONT=verdana,geneva"]
Engine

Layout 6
Max power 493 bhp at 6000 rpm
Max torque 479 lb ft at 1950 rpm[/LIST][FONT=verdana,geneva"][FONT=verdana,geneva"][FONT=verdana,geneva"][FONT=verdana,geneva"]




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