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Incoming GTS 4.0 - ‘Bill and Hold’ process?

Spenny

PCGB Member
Member
Some advice please from those recently taken delivery of their GTS 4.0.
My new car has passed stage 4 and is therefore built and presumably ‘on its way’ to the UK.
My dealer rang me a couple of weeks ago and asked if I could pay for the car before end December. I said very clearly that I would pay for it if it had arrived at dealer and I could see it, which I thought was reasonable?
I now suspect it’s not arriving before end December as I have had an email from my dealer asking as follows (note that the ‘Bill and Hold’ process was never discussed with me before)

Further to our conversation, here is a quick email that explains the Bill and Hold process.

Effectively, the bits and pieces that we require are as follows.
- Full payment for the vehicle before the 31st of December (ideally as soon as possible to avoid any Christmas Banking issues)
- A signed Bill and Hold Letter
- A copy of an insurance document that shows the Cayman is fully insured as of the 31st of December.

IS THIS REASONABLE?

Surely I shouldn’t have to pay until it arrives at the dealer?
Am I better to pay in case there is another price rise?
Is the money not better sat in my account earning interest until car delivered?
Why would I have to insure it when it hasn’t even arrived?
Have I signed something at some point that refers to the bill and hold process, I’ll have to check this?
Is the dealer just trying to hit end of year sales forecast/target?

I would be really interested in any experiences of this.
I’m sceptical of their motive but maybe it’s normal practice?

Any advice really appreciated as I will have to respond on Wednesday this week.
 
Is the dealer just trying to hit end of year sales forecast/target?

Most likely....

Does it set warranty start/tax due/first registration dates?

Why do you have to insure it (they carry insurance for customers' cars on their premises) other than as part of the dates process above?

Is there a guaranteed customer delivery date?

I normally pay one or two days before delivery and after I've seen it in the flesh (my Centre only a few miles away so no need for video walk around instead)

What are they going to do for you in return?

 
There's a pretty good chance they want to tax it before the end of the year hence the reason for the need for insurance and for the car to be fully paid up as this can't be done unless it's registered in your name.

OPCs get the cars P11D by post usually a week before the car arrives at the dealership so it can be added to the Porsche system and registered before PDI then it will have a plate to put on at PDI.

Like Ralph said, they probably want their end of December numbers.

 
Bill and hold is an accounting/ legal device designed to allow a vendor to recognise sales where a customer cannot for some valid reason take physical delivery of the goods e.g lack of storage space. In order for the approach to be valid (and pass external audit/ internal business controls) the primary test is whether control of the goods has passed to the customer.

So unless the car is physically at the OPC and available for delivery by 31/12, you paying for the car or insuring it will not in my view pass this test - so ultimately from the OPCs year end numbers perspective the approach will fail in this circumstance no matter how keen the salesman/sales manager/ dealer principal are to hit their targets.

Sales are not recognised for accounting purposes simply because the customer has paid - it’s a bit more complex than that - I’m a retired FCA and have been the accountant for several motor dealerships (including 2 OPCs) in my career.

The OPC cannot register a car they don’t physically have and or have not purchased from PCGB.

Clearly if the car is not onsite there is also absolutely no benefit to you in paying for or insuring it early - in fact given delivery delays and vehicles tuning up with parts missing at the moment if it were me I’d rather risk a few days delay in delivery rather than rushing the process. Once you’ve paid your leverage has gone.

If the car is physically available for delivery by 31/12 then you have a choice I suppose on whether to agree to this (personally I’d be waiting for the year to roll over) or to negotiate something in return.

I would be surprised if this is an OPC from one of the publicly quoted motor dealers as they should be pretty hot on the controls that exist to prevent misreporting of year end numbers having been hit by a series of issues around miss selling and reporting in recent years.

I think in your shoes I would be calling the Sales Manager or DP tomorrow and asking for an explanation. If you don’t like what you hear keep escalating.

 
All the above. If as part of the purchase and/or finance deal (delete as applicable) you previously agreed to a price/rate which was based on you taking delivery of the car before year end if they were able to fulfil it, I suspect they are within their rights if they can fulfil it within the accountancy rules. If you didn't, or more specifically your deal was based on a delivery date in 2023, I suspect they are trying it on to make their numbers and you should have some power to negotiate something in lieu of taking it earlier than you would wish. It's probably all in their contract T's and C's.

 
Yes agree with above, OPC looking to count the car as a 2022 completed deal asking for payment and taxing it. Interesting why they want to waste your money on insuring a car that you won't be able to drive. Smells like an opportunity to ask for something or see how important it is to them.

Anyway sounds like you will picking up a car soon, enjoy.

 
I think you will find that you can't insure a car that isn't registered and that the dealer can't register a car than hasn't arrived at the dealership .. a bit catch 22

 
Personally I’d be uncomfortable paying for a car I’d not ‘seen in the flesh’ and not something I’ve done. I’ve only bought one Porsche which was during COVID so saw a video of it From the dealer. All my other cars (BMW’s) I’ve gone to the dealer to see and I’ve only had to pay close to collection. mikeg makes a good point that you can’t insure it anyway without the plate.

 
I'm in a slightly similar situation but with a much different response from the OPC. I'm also getting a CGTS 4.0 Mine was delivered on 23rd Dec to dealer. It was sat there until yesterday when the company doing the PPF and ceramic coating picked it up. It'll be with them until about 2nd week of Jan, where upon I'll be collecting and paying for the car.

. Not had anything about paying for the car in advance. In fact... they've been absolutely superb with the customer experience thus far.

 
It is disappointing when the dealers play these 'games' and the customer is expected to just go along with it. I imagine it is sorted one way or another now, but it would be helpful to hear how it played out in the end and how long you actually have to wait for delivery.

To summarise, they are trying to include it in their December numbers and build a body of evidence to support that strategy.

Payment = point of sale

'Bill and hold' allows them to register the car in your name (they will have all the details even though they do not have the car) It also implies that you have purchased the car and asked them to defer delivery.

Insurance is needed as otherwise the car, registered in your name, could not be taxed and would show on the DVLA database as uninsured.

Despite all the above, you are getting a great car. Welcome to the Cayman world. Enjoy!

 
Explained my thoughts as politely as possible in an email last week and had a reply 48 hrs later simply saying that they understood and will get back in touch this week to arrange a handover date. Strange though, still no mention of when they actually expect delivery of the car? Assume they think it’s imminent? All good generally as obviously won’t be paid for until at dealers and will be registered as a 2023 car.

 
GregThoma said:
Any update from the dealer
Yes, got an email Wednesday saying they expected the car into dealer this week and asked what date could I collect the following week. I've suggested next Friday as assumed they need car for a few days to do PDI.

Will ring them Monday if I don't hear today as to whether car has landed at the dealer.

 

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