987.2: Observations and a question

[911hillclimber]

Some will remember I had (have?) a cold start smoke problem intermittently on my 2.9.
This resulted in the Service action ECU update being carried out (which was not done by the first owner/OPC) before Xmas.

Several starts later, long runs/sloping drive/short runs all is WELL! Early days maybe, but good so far. The AOS I bought is still in its bag.

While at the OPC for the ECU update, I was advised upon collection of the car that there was a coolant weep from the front 'rack' pipes. "About £1300 Sir"
I suggested I would fix it DIY, the severity of the leak of the coolant was not quantified, all I know is the temp gauge is rock steady no matter what, no drips under the car...etc.

Because I have a bit of garage space for the next 2 weeks I thought it was cold enough to endure a good look at the connections to the pipes. Up with the nose and off with the wheels.

The steel connections to the alum pipes are all great! No corrosion, no fluid leaks. I liberally sprayed WD40 all over them to help disperse water and put it all back together and washed the car.
Dissapointing to be told of a problem, DIY parts are £340 for a 'kit' or OPC will charge £1300, but there isn't a problem!

While at the front I checked the nice new A/C rads I fitted in November. I was surprised to find big dry oak leaves in there and about 20 'dings' from stones that have flattened a few fins locally.
I fished the leaves out and I'm buying a set of grills after I've typed this little message.

Having now 'saved' at least £340, spent £190 on the grills and still have garage space, I fancy replacing the exhaust corroded nuts between manifolds and cats, those ones....
Seems it is a game of patience and brute force, any comments?

Finally, went for a drive into Wales yesterday just because I fancied some time from working on the old 911, and found a few spots to use this car as Porsche intended...

Does that engine ever sound good above 6K! I think I'm back in love.

 

[turbo jonny]

Good to see enthusiasts enjoying their Porsche , despite the A/H Dealers who are a disgrace to the brand ??

 

[Motorhead]

Good to hear that the 'smoking' problem appears to have been cured - fingers crossed for you!

Not unusual to hear that the dealership is fishing for work; it's what they always do. Slight coolant leakage around the front pipes is a known occurence - best just to keep an eye on the joints for seepage.

Chocolate exhaust nuts and bolts are also a common occurence with the modern water-cooled cars - that's value engineering for you! Time to get out the Dremmel/hacksaw/hammer and chisel/nut splitter/blowtorch I think?

Jeff

 

[AndrewT]

I fancy replacing the exhaust corroded nuts between manifolds and cats, those ones....

I’m pleased to hear that the smoke on start up may have been cured/improved.

I knew the manifold/cat bolts were rusty on my old 2.9 Cayman 987.2 were corroded, then when performing a start at a hillclimb they all snapped at the same time, so it’s well worth replacing then sooner rather than later.

The problem is that they are in fact splined studs pressed in from the manifold side, access is very limited making it difficult to remove them by knocking them out or drilling them. I paid a Porsche specialist in Eastleigh about £300 to replace them.

When I bought my current Cayman S I sent it straight to Steve Bull in Devizes who replaced all six for about £148 +vat including parts and labour.

With regard to the suspected water loss, have you noticed any drop in level when looking in the filler (or is that not as easy to see as it is on a Cayman)?

Andrew

 

[911hillclimber]

I think my favourite indie, Zuffenhaus quoted £125 a side to do them, it looks a bitch of a job, so might spend the money with them having saved myself from the pipe replacement bill.
thought it a bit dishonest of OPC, they are hardly 'Sid's Autos' under the arches.

zunsport black grill meshes on order.

Thanks for your replies. []

 

[JMR]

Nice reading 911hillclimber []

I've got black Zunsports on mine. Fitted same day as replacing the a/c condensers (as I write many times over on here lol)

Zentrum (Porsche Specialists) in Calverton, Notts replaced my sheared exhaust bolts for £120 job lot for both sides.
Two bolts sheared on the passenger side and there was a 5mm gap between the flanges - hell that was a NOISY drive to the garage !

 

[911hillclimber]

I'll ask for a Zuffenhaus quote. They are quite close to me and very easy to deal with.
Chris there showed me the rusty (as in no nut flats left) fixings and advised me to fix them before the MoT or before they fail and the exhaust blows while he showed me a previous indie's cock-up on the oil filter change.
I'm getting the car ready for a good road trip to Italy in May.[]

 

[legin]

On the exhaust studs I have just done mine. Took me about 3 hrs with the odd break to do both sides. I think the method i used was pretty straightforward but not easy of course.

Use an air die grinder with carbide acorn tip to grind the remaining stud and nut until the exhaust is free.
Remove the exhaust
Cut the stud flush with the cat flange using a cutting disc in the die grinder. An alternative is to use the acorn grinder again
Get a suitable punch (needs to be a decent strength steel like a 12.9 )and a 2lb hammer. I used a cut down pointed k series cylinder head bolt about 200mm long
Heat the flange at each stud in turn until its red , std propane torch will do
Drift the stud out , comes out with two or three hard whacks.
New gaskets and nuts and bolts your done

 

[legin]

The grinder

 

[911hillclimber]

Thank you for your reply.
I don't have the die grinder!
There is a good video on YouTube by a keen DIY man with the car on a rented 4 poster, an angle grinder and some hard drilling to remove the core 8mm of each stud. The top one of the 'triangle' they were lucky with as it came out (no heat) and they drilled eventually the other 2 out, new gasket, 3 new bolts and nuts, one side done. As the other side was not blowing, they left it to another day.

3 hours to do the one side with good access but regular garage tools.
And determination.
And 2 of them!

I think Zuffenhaus approach it as you have. I'm sure heat makes all the difference to the effort.

It is the top one that looks very awkward to get to. (?)

 

[legin]

If you dont have the tools then either borrow some or I would suggest pay the garage to do it that does have the tools and methodology.

All three are ok to get to (but Im used to difficult jobs) there is just one piece of arch liner to get out the way. I spotted the video before i started and tbh they made a meal of it and left the other side for another day not because it was OK, both sides will be the same condition.

The method I have explained works and is relatively quick as 3 hrs both sides and remove exhaust plus a short break.

 

[911hillclimber]

Good to hear from some one who has actually done it.
I have a good compressor so will look closer into the tools.
Best I remove the wheels etc and remind myself what state they are all in.
being retired means I have the time!

 

[malarcy]

Local OPC pointed mine out as "needing doing in the next 6 months" as part of the free winter check - so I should think about doing it / getting it done. Whats the standard replacement, is it stainless nuts and bolts (as would seem sensible) - or some kind of replacement stud arrangement.?

 

[legin]

Yes replaced with stainless steel nuts and bolts is the way to go. Approx 8mm x 25 long from memory.

 

[911hillclimber]

Will take a look at mine this weekend and see about the access and my drill.

meanwhile, the grills came today and aboth fitted, pleased and look as if they will be VERY effective.

 

[911hillclimber]

 

[legin]

I put some mesh in whilst I had the front off doing the a/c rads and Im also hopeful its going to make things better. I dont want to disillusion you but a drill isnt going to work but you may prove me wrong.

 

[911hillclimber]

I think you could well be right!
its all I have of that nature, so will see. I'll soon know after 30 seconds....
it took the chap on YouTube 3 hours for 3 fasteners.

I do have a nifty Oxy acetelyn torch though!

However....
just looked on eBay and for about £35 I can get the grinder and bits.
now, that is tempting....

 

[Motorhead]

Why didn't Porsche think to specify nuts and bolts in the first place.!? All down to 'value engineering' of course with little thought given to future replacement.

Jeff

 

[911hillclimber]

Agree, this particular task underlines why I don't like working on modern cars.
they are designed for production, for assembly and staying together for about 2 x the warrantee!
the splined stud in the one half makes it easy to fit the nut with an air driver, zappppp and its home to the right torques etc.

For me, WHY weren't stainless studs used and a copper plated nut?
long term maintenance is of no concern when building a modern car.