GT4 buying advice

[Francis Jackson]

Hi all
I am looking at buying a GT4 to be driven rather than keeping at a low mileage in a garage. I would be taking it on European trips, weekend drives and a few track days each year.
What options have others felt worthwhil, enhanced the experienc? Are PCCB more hardwearing now? Are the buckets comfortable for long journey. I’ll be sitting in the seats for test drives but I don’t think the sellers will humour me and let me sit in them for two/ three hours?
All views and opinions appreciate.
Many thanks
Francis

 

[ChrisW]

You will find a thousand different answers to this ... but to answer your questions from my perspective:

1. The PCCB's were great value for money and I'm not aware of any of this generation being destroyed on a GT4. But the steel brakes are also very good -- I just like to make the most of the steering feel, handling, lack of brake dust and no rusting if the car lives out -- so I went for PCCB.

2. Bucket seats ... a real event, comfortable, great on track ... and essential with club sport and full harnesses.

3. The fancy headlights are very good and self adjust for continental driving

4. PCM of this generation ultimately ages a car ... some say it's essential, I take the opposite view.

5. Auto aircon is important to me (dual zone heating ?)

6. Leather / Alcantara / Carbon are all nice but cosmetic ...

7. Decent sound is good for long trips (it should be standard) / Digital radio

8. Prompt me ... my opener

 

[ChrisW]

Happy hunting It is probably the most fun Porsche that I have owned ... and so practical even with modified suspension optimised for track days. Not that you have to, but I have saved in "not prematurely" worn tyres what the modifications have cost me ...

This is the only "step too far" concession to the hierarchy of the GT3 ... IMHO. But a lot are not tracked ...

 

[geoff lane]

Francis

Your usage is exactly the same as mine and you cannot beat a GT4 I have this year done 2 x 8 day driving holidays, 1 to Austria, Switzerland & Italy and 1 to the north of Scotland NC500 from Devon as well as 3 track days and the usual run outs with PCGB etc.

The 918 buckets I find very comfortable and part of the experience of having a GT car, I also think the leather pack and carbon make for a nice cabin and would always choose for the my type of usage. I have PCCB on mine and think they are very good, as Chris says the feel is superb and of course the lack of brake dust is an added bonus, my only concern is you can get stones caught, I find if you reverse they generally come straight out. I would make sure you get PCM if only for resale. I don't have a clubsport so no harnesses (but I'm not as quick or on it on track days as Chris) but my track days are just for a bit of fun not chasing lap times, the upside of no cage is no rattles which a lot tell me is an annoyance.

I have no regrets with mine the only downside on touring holidays is noise there is a lot of tyre noise as there is little insulation so don't bother with fancy hifi upgrades, the upside the exhaust is lovely when revved out so keep the window down and enjoy.

They are a great car I'm sure if you bite the bullet you won't be disappointed.

Geoff

 

[MrDemon]

just watch the prices, they are dropping daily.

I don't fit in the 918 buckets and really hated them, but the car does need buckets to gain a sale these days on the whole.

but folding bucket seated cars are rare.

you cannot spec Bose on the GT4 so not a thing to look at.

cars sell better with leather.

imo PCM is really poor most spec for resale, but you get the money back, but it's an old PCM unit sadly.

new car markets not the same as used, so specing new you spec high as possible as you get all your money back and the cars easy to sell higher the spec.

2nd hand buy on miles and condition , and if it's missing PCM offer cheaper price

If they drop to £60k I buy another one to mod, at todays money you are better off trying to order a new one.

lots for sale now, due to A winter b: 3 year deals ending c: people bailing out before more price drops due to the new one.

if you want one today buy the PTS VOODOO blue one at £76k highest spec in the country so the addvert says.

BUT it LACKS PCM AND CLIMATE and also does not say if it has Bluetooth for a phone, sadly a must have for me today is a blue tooth phone connection.

PCM is a must have for some, and as above climate can be, so sort of high spec but missing a lot.

Goes to show what trade bids are if he is selling private for £79k , I am sure if would take £76k in a dropping market that would be under list price.

you do see cars at £69k and will take offers and they all drive the same !! a cheap car is a happy modders car

 

[Steve Brookes]

Buy the one that you are happy with. Buying ones with a certain spec for future re-sale is no longer relevant now that the cars are 3+ years old. Speccing for re-sale was only relevant to the flippers to maximize their gains. If you buy one with 'the right spec for re-sale' you pay a high price to sell at a high price. If you buy one with low spec you pay a low price and sell at a low price. So, in the end, the amount you lose when re-selling is the same. It's just the capital amounts that are different.

So my advice is buy the one that feels right for you. You'll know when you sit in it for a few minutes if it's the right one. I agree with Geoff regarding the interior. Mine is leather and alcantara and it makes the cabin feel very special. I went for the two way 'comfort' sports plus seats and have found them excellent for all uses (including numerous track days). I purposely wanted steel brakes because replacement costs will be far easier to stomach. They are more than up to the job for track work. PCCBs could be an issue when the cars are 5 years old i.e. they could make the car difficult to sell on as folk would be wary of the cost of replacing the discs. I like that I got one with PCM and Sports chrono too. Again, makes the cabin look just right. The yellow steering wheel marker is also a delightful touch. The only thing I miss on mine is the auto climate control. To get the auto function you need the dual zone option that Chris has.

The GT4 is a superb two person tourer. It soaks up the bumps and has better road manners than my previous Cayman R.

Utterly brilliant car to own and drive. []

 

[Ray]

Dreams, I had a dream and bought the car of those dreams. Sadly we parted company and I still regret that sale. Now the price of that dream car is too much and I shall never get another (tear in eye).

Buy what you can afford and love your choice.

Ray

 

[MrDemon]

Buy the one that you are happy with. Buying ones with a certain spec for future re-sale is no longer relevant now that the cars are 3+ years old. Speccing for re-sale was only relevant to the flippers to maximize their gains. If you buy one with 'the right spec for re-sale' you pay a high price to sell at a high price. If you buy one with low spec you pay a low price and sell at a low price. So, in the end, the amount you lose when re-selling is the same. It's just the capital amounts that are different.

the issue is it's a small market these cars, so yes you buy cheap sell cheap, but it's no good if there are no buyers, and like any car, high spec sells easier

you only have to look at the 987.2 R's for sale and the one's which sell faster have the 6 main items people want, some won't sell even £10k cheaper as no one wants the spec.

I want to know I can get out of my cars pretty quick in a private sale. over ditching it with a dealer (£10k loss) for a low part ex or worse still on a SOR which no one ever buys, and you have no car to drive and no money !

So imo right spec for resale is pretty key to keeping more of your own money in your own pocket and moving cars on faster.

you might be ok saving £2k on a buying a car with no PCM, but then you limit the market when you sell, why risk it ?

 

[Steve Brookes]

Rubbish David. There is a buyer for every car. You're a spec sort of person. There are lots of other people who are not. The OP is similar to me in that he wants to buy a GT4 to drive and enjoy, not to resell in a short space of time.

 

[Motorhead]

Well said Steve.

Purchasers of used cars accept that in the majority of cases the spec will be a compromise - you just need to set your red lines. And with little prospect of the next GT4 arriving on our shores before the middle of next year, what you see is what you get if like Francis you're looking for a car to get in and drive now.

I do wonder how many GT4 owners - and for that matter Porsche owners in general - ever bother to look on the forums.

Good to hear of your positive experience with the GT4.

Jeff

 

[MrDemon]

Rubbish David. There is a buyer for every car. You're a spec sort of person. There are lots of other people who are not. The OP is similar to me in that he wants to buy a GT4 to drive and enjoy, not to resell in a short space of time.

I would love to say it's rubbish also, but we have GT4's at £69k for sale all summer while £80k cars are selling

we have buyers on Cayman R at £45+ while cars at £37k are not selling.

we have 991.2 GT3 up for sale at £145k stuck for months and high spec cars are selling at £160k+

try and buy a 997.2 C2S in manual (I have been for 4 months) , rocking horse shit really, PDK 10 a penny in any colour you like.

it's pretty black and white, if you buy a low spec car even though it's cheaper it's far harder to move on, and we all move them on at some point.

he might think it's a deal now to save £3k but in 2 years when it's been up for sale 8 months he will regret that move and will have to part ex it in at a £10k to 15k loss.

yes there is a buyer for every car but as spec drops so does the buying market from a tiny market to 1 or 2 people on a lucky day if the suns out.

all the cars we drive to enjoy, but you can limit the costs to own and hence why I drive a high spec GT3 due to being savy , or running 2 x Cayman R's and selling both private for the same money I paid for them ! 5 years free motoring in one of Porsche best ever cars ! and my 987.2 Spyders gone up £15k !

my GT4 sold within a week also, although I had to part ex that one, but it shows the spec I choose sold the car very fast along with the good price my OPC sold it for.

I am not a spec sort of guy I am a guy with limited funds for a hobby I love, so one has to watch the market as to what sells and what people want to own in the main and what looks the best value, as the cheapest cars never seem the best value to me.

all my cars I sold private at top money, that's for a reason, spec spec spec. be it my old Lotus, my 996 GT3, my R's etc etc all private sales as dealer prices.

 

[Ray]

People buy what they can afford. If money is no object then you can purchase a new vehicle with the exact spec your heart desires. If however you have a budget then you purchase a vehicle to suit your pocket. Now this could be a fully loaded vehicle but high mileage on it's side. Or, you could purchase a younger vehicle with less gadgets installed.

Once again the choice is down to the individual. If you are happy with your purchase just what the hell has it to do with any other person? If people start making judgments of a persons choice then thats a pretty sad state of affairs. Also if your purchase is made with resale values in mind why bother driving it, just leave it in the garage. In the meanwhile the purchaser of the lesser loaded vehicle is probably enjoying his drive.

Ray

 

[geoff lane]

Francis asked for general opinions having stated a few questions he was particularly interested in understanding.

I am sure he will sift through the thread and take on board the views of GT4 owners and make up his own mind based on the criteria he has set himself.

This was clearly a knowledge gathering exercise and hopefully we have all contributed in a positive fashion.

I am sure we have not put him off buying what is probably the best sports car of its type available today.

 

[snowy999]

I went through similar thoughts over past few months and bough one early November, appreciateing that the prices may well drop once we see what if if the new GT4 is like.

I have driven it to Spa and back and around Spa.

So my tuppenny worth:

1. I bought one from a dealer as I wanted a warranty. Mine still had a year's regular 'new' to go and 2 years extended. I wont mod it yet and am happy to have this cover.

2. From a spec perspective - it had to have:

- 'Club Sport' Spec, and both harnesses - I think this looks great. Others will disagree and the rear cage is added weight and makes the rear cubby holes tricky to use.

- Sports bucket seats, I have found these super comfortable and Mrs Snow found the same having hated my M3 CSL and GOlf R seats. However the 9 year old needs a cushion to raise her up to seeing out.

- Sports Chrono - I like the dash clock and the fact that I could use the Porsche TrackApp.

- PASM/bluetooth prep - yes a dated system but my brother 996 (2001) still works nicely and if you keep the car for a long term it can be removed and replaced a la clubsport

- I didnt wnat leather but I read that lots of people do

- Colour - I wnated white, couldnt be red, yellow or grey. I would have liked a SIlver one as an alternative. Ive seen a Green one for sale that looks great but not with me in it.

- Steel brakes. I know the PCCBs are great tech but if they go wrong and are not covered by warranty they are epicly expensive to repalce. I dfound the steel brakes more than adequte at Spa where your average lap speed is c90-95mph.

- upgraded loudspeakers

- low miles - I set a level of 5k

Have fun looking and enjoy your car, I am.

Snowy

 

[Ray]

Geoff,

Yes, advice on a particular car/spec is always helpful.

Ray

 

[MrDemon]

People buy what they can afford. If money is no object then you can purchase a new vehicle with the exact spec your heart desires. If however you have a budget then you purchase a vehicle to suit your pocket. Now this could be a fully loaded vehicle but high mileage on it's side. Or, you could purchase a younger vehicle with less gadgets installed.

Once again the choice is down to the individual. If you are happy with your purchase just what the hell has it to do with any other person? If people start making judgments of a persons choice then thats a pretty sad state of affairs. Also if your purchase is made with resale values in mind why bother driving it, just leave it in the garage. In the meanwhile the purchaser of the lesser loaded vehicle is probably enjoying his drive.

Ray

I find comments like this a bit misleading and agro for no reason !! , As the OP asked for advice on options and spec on a forum. You state "what the hell has it got to do with other people" the OP ASKED for advice , I have given a honest review having driven and owned all the above cars and watching the market like a hawk and having to sell them. (I been trying to be a super car dealer for 3 years so a big learning curve and buying wrong can cost you £££ )

I am still in I.T grrrr but I spend 20+ hours a week on what cars sell in what markets and makes inc. Spec etc etc. will I make the jump from hobby to dealer, I hope so at some point.

ALso with my pretend dealer hat on, I would not even want a car in stock which was low spec, knowing I cannot sell it very easy even at any price. there was a £65k 981 SPyder for sale, it's still for sale, it's a shocking car and VERY cheap and now it's back at a dealer for more and NOT SOLD all summer !!! it's now at £75k, 10k more than it was when it did not sell the 1st time !!!!

SOR as well so the owner has no car to use and the cars dropping in value daily " LEMON SPEC car !

as we have seen some owners have stated they would want "leather " and another wanted "climate" I want "Bluetooth" I would say none of us would buy a car without the bits we wanted to save £1k on a £80k car ! so that means less people go for lesser spec cars.

I am shocked how many people would refuse to buy a car with no DAB !!!

if you cannot afford to jump from a £69k car to a £73k car then you cannot afford to loose £15k either ! we are not talking poor people driving £2k shitters here. we are talking people who can afford to buy a £80k car as a toy.

I am giving the best advice to buy a car which will cost the least to own over all, nothing to do with miles or judgments or garage queens or forum effect.

I always have resale in mind as I cannot afford to lose £15k on a car myself, that does not mean I drive it less or enjoy it less, what it does mean is I can sell it at top money within a month if needed and on the plus side I get to enjoy the extra spec it has.

one has to be VERY rich to not have the resale nag in the back of your mind.

I can make a plan for anyone on any wage to own a super car, but one has to be strict and clever about it.

my advice is free, people can choose to take it or leave it, but I try to lead by example which is clear what cars I have ran and own atm .

 

[Ray]

This was not meant as an aggro piece. It was meant to be about people purchasing what they please and the choice is theirs.

Ray

 

[SpyderDavid]

This was not meant as an aggro piece. It was meant to be about people purchasing what they please and the choice is theirs.

Ray

The OP made no mention of resale value or vehicle prices - I personally find it a bit tedious when genuine requests for information morph into pretty unhelpful discussions about future values or so called “must have” options.

I have had fixed buckets in 3 Porsches now going back nearly 20 years, including the 918 variety in my Spyder and personally find them very comfortable, even on extended trips - but this does seem to vary by individual, so if you can find a way to try the type in any car you are are serious about. My car has PCCBs and I think they are great - but probably would have bought a car that lacked them, just so happened that one came up in a colour I liked with them on.

If I ever spec a new car again it will have both of these options because I will enjoy the car more with them and don't feel the need to rationalise my choice to a future owner.

 

[Ray]

This was not meant as an aggro piece. It was meant to be about people purchasing what they please and the choice is theirs.

Ray

The OP made no mention of resale value or vehicle prices - I personally find it a bit tedious when genuine requests for information morph into pretty unhelpful discussions about future values or so called “must have” options.

I have had fixed buckets in 3 Porsches now going back nearly 20 years, including the 918 variety in my Spyder and personally find them very comfortable, even on extended trips - but this does seem to vary by individual, so if you can find a way to try the type in any car you are are serious about. My car has PCCBs and I think they are great - but probably would have bought a car that lacked them, just so happened that one came up in a colour I liked with them on.

If I ever spec a new car again it will have both of these options because I will enjoy the car more with them and don't feel the need to rationalise my choice to a future owner.

My thoughts exactly.

Ray

 

[981TC]

Hi all

I am looking at buying a GT4 to be driven rather than keeping at a low mileage in a garage. I would be taking it on European trips, weekend drives and a few track days each year.

What options have others felt worthwhil, enhanced the experienc? Are PCCB more hardwearing now? Are the buckets comfortable for long journey. I’ll be sitting in the seats for test drives but I don’t think the sellers will humour me and let me sit in them for two/ three hours?

All views and opinions appreciate.

Many thanks

Francis

All the best with the search, for me the following spec was a must:

Buckets with belts

sports Chrono

clubsport I track mine

PCCB

Satnav and bluetooth

cruise control

low mileage, I brought with 2k

black wheels

and it had to be white, the car just looks amazing in white

the rest of the spec was just a nice to have

my only comments are the seats, whilst it may affect resale, if you are going to use the car a lot you may wish to avoid buckets. Whilst they are fabulous and comfortable, they are not the easiest to get in and out of in my experience.

Good luck and I hope you find your dream GT4