Diesels...how long do they have left?

[PSH]

I see in the news that 'Which' tested IIRC 61 new Eu6 diesel cars, 47 of which failed their emissions?... I can hear the demands to scrap all diesel's now, I bet it won't be long, much sooner than planned at least. In other news I also read that newly developed batteries can now be charged at a rate not much slower than it takes to fill a tank of petrol/diesel?.....change is a coming chaps.....don't sell your classics, they may be the only decent cars on the road one day...we hope...

Pete

 

[PhilKent]

My only issue with electric cars (apart from the obvious issue of where the power comes from to charge the batteries, produce the batteries, dispose of the batteries etc) is the fact you hardy hear them coming, particularly when travelling slowly in towns. They'll have to be fitted with noise generators like council run vehicles reversing
Considering the electric motor was invented before they invented the IC engine it's a shame it hasn't been used more sooner. We'd have figured out all this power source issues years ago if they had..
However, saying all that, I'll always be keeping the 944 I love a good petrol engine! And it shows by my car purchases, I'm a late adopter....

 

[blade7]

I saw something recently that stated the battery lifespan and the cost of replacement, effectively wrote off an electric car way sooner than petrol models.

 

[Waylander]

My cousin has a Lexus 450h

a battery replacement is 8k

 

[PSH]

I can see battery cars being something you replace often...another 'throw away' product......in the meantime the 'planet' dies...we are pretty close to that already...we won't see it but I fear for my grandchildren...

 

[Eldavo]

We ran a Leaf for 2 years and then replaced it with a 10 year old Boxster.

You’d have been forgiven for thinking the Boxster was 2 years old and the Leaf 10 by the interiors, the quality of the plastics and cloth, etc. in the Nissan was awful and wore very badly. In a further 5 years the Boxster will still be going strong and the Leaf will be sat collecting dust like a VHS recorder in a loft.

Yes it was cheap motoring and good fun burning GTis off at the lights but the range never went over 86miles and was usually far less - especially if you dared to put the heater on! The thing is m, I love my Merc diesel daily driver, loads of torque, great fuel economy on a decent run, none of the weight and complexity of a hybrid system and more importantly its cradle to grave environmental impact doesn’t involve strip mining Lithium.

 

[andrew0401]

All very well saying that diesels are dying and the electric car is way forward - but most goods travel by van or lorry, all diesel powered and there seems far less investment in their replacement.

Shall we also ignore the level of investment required to have charging points at every property? Most house supplies will not copy with 35KW power demands let alone multiple vehicles on one circuit. Then think of the local transformer that is delivering power to many houses - the power demands will be enormous.

 

[Waylander]

done 400 miles in my diesel A4 Quattro today, all motorway most of it 70 or just above, average of 52MPG and only £35.00 fuel

the train ticket was quoted at £129.00 return before 9am, plus £10 to park the car at the station, is it really worth the 30K overhead for a decent Hybrid, and pass the pollution on to a third world country, at this juncture in the world i think that's a definite NOOOOOO

 

[PSH]

not sure how they plan to deal with the charging issue, other than the solar paint already developed that self-charges the car...they've already developed lorries that far outperform anything that an IC engine could cope with...I believe the new Tesla can travel over 1000 miles between charges...London council has been testing electric trucks for some time now, their dumpster trucks can do a 10-hour shift on a single charge. Any hurdles involved have already been thought of and dealt with..the new batteries announced a couple of weeks back that are charged in a similar time to filling a tank sorts out the speed of charge issue...btw I'm no fan, I'll hang on to my classic for as long as the government lets me use it on the road...although buying fuel may be beyond my means..it's nad enough now..lol

Pete

 

[Waylander]

not sure the charging issues are dealt with, i live where there is a common car park for all of us, now the flats used to be for the old folks and over the 25 years i have been here the council now lets anyone and his dog have the flats, so with 9 parking spaces and 20 dwellings we cant park most of the time anyway,

we as a family have 3 cars, mine, the wife's, the daughter (District Nurse) so thats 30% of the car park gone, the road is 40 metres from my house and a main road, so where do they suggest we all charge our cars in the future,

we cant park here after 6pm as the car park is full, it is a normal estate with twice as many cars as there are spaces this must be repeated 10000 times throughout the UK, so the charging issue is not sorted, the charging paint is all very good but in out winter months it will get you to the end of the street,

electric is not practical in any shape or form currently for the UK

 

[PSH]

I was referring to the ability to charge an electric vehicle in a reasonable time frame, not the logistics of owners being able to do so from home...whether it's practical or not is irrelevant, it will happen and it will happen very soon..I'm 58 and I worry if petrol engines will still be on the road during what's left of my lifetime. I suspect not, diesel's most certainly not, they'll be gone very soon, you can feel it in the wind 'so to speak'

 

[944Scott]

The main problem is two fold, supply and infrastructure. We only produce 5% more electricity than we need and they were talking a decade ago about having to ration electricity due to our ageing power stations. So where do we put all the charging points? many households have multi car ownership, many dwellings do not even have a dedicated parking space. What happens when you need juice on the go? Take a busy petrol station and observe how many vehicles that could pass through it in an equivalent charge time of say 37 minutes, how big would that charging site have to be? What do the people who play chance with range to empty and end up stopping by the side of the road, how many EV's have a box in box out emergency battery supply.

Yes it has to happen sometime but a considerable amount of more effort need to be put in place for it to work.

 

[richardjjs1]

And how long do they last at 8k replacement

 

[Peter_Bull]

…………………. how big would that charging site have to be? ……………………...

I have the answer to that: an onsite diesel generator [][]

 

[PSH]

I hear on the news today that a new E type is being made...electric of course....I doubt if any new IC engined cars will be developed from this point on, a few in the pipeline will appear perhaps for another 5 years, but that will be it.

 

[Waylander]

And how long do they last at 8k replacement

Well Toyota only warranty them for 5 years, or you can cough up for a 11 year warranty

http://www.thebatteryclinic.co.nz/how-long-will-a-hybrid-battery-last/

 

[Paul 290T]

The average UK house requires on average 0.5kW of electricity to run. Obviously peak loads will push this up, let say it might peak at 5kW. The Nissan Leaf has four charging rates: Lets pick the slow, overnight 7 hr charge, that requires 7kW to 22kW, (and not the fast 50kW charge) their website is not clear. Anyone think their house electrical supply has this much spare capacity built in?

So suddenly your house needs between 40% to 340% more power supply capability than at present. As will most houses in the UK, based on even single car ownership per house.

It seems pretty clear that the charging requirement of large scale electric car roll out will require an almost total replacement of the national grid. Then as mentioned already new power stations will need to be installed. Last I heard there's a 15 year waiting list on nuclear power stations.

Does anyone think that all of the infrastructure changes listed above will happen?

In the meantime oil reserves through new discoveries and more economic recovery technologies are extending each year. Now i am not advocating continued reliance of fossil fuels in the way forward, but does anyone care to place bets on whether new IC cars will really be unavailable in the UK 22 years from now?

 

[PSH]

I for one would bet on that Paul...today all motor companies are investing in electric, not just investing but scrapping their current IC range...landrover for example where 95% of it's current range are diesel, has already announced that there will be no diesel engines in it's range in less than two years. Today we have new electric cars either on the drawing board, developed or being launched from small town cars to supercars...Porsche has already shown it's new all-electric 911 lookalike car.

I think you are looking at the charging issue a little 'blinkered' to me the way to go would be to forget charging from home, the easy route and something that could be done very quickly is the conversion of all fuel stations to electric charge centers. The required grid would only need to run to the network of charging centers across the country, not such a big task in comparison. I suspect that this grid would be independent to the national grid with it's own power stations. There would be no 'charging at home' option, after all, we don't refill our cars with fuel at home so no big hardship. To say that new oil reserves has a bearing on this is wrong, the decision to go electric has little to do with oil reserves, it's much more a conscious decision to improve the world and it's inhabitants life, fossil fuels especially diesel and in cities today are killing countless thousands and costing an untold amount in health care. The UK has stated that no new IC engined cars can be sold from 2040, there's debate in the house right now to reduce this time span to 2030 or less. This is what's changing car companies plans on future car development, why all are looking at electric and why I doubt any will be spending any resources on future IC cars. I suspect new cars from now on will be variants of old models (except any already off the drawing board) in a bid to reduce the parts and tooling costs from this point on, its just sound business practice.

 

[vitesse]

Our home uses 2300kw per year-notionally 6 per day so using a 7 kW charging point would be no big deal -even a 15 kW charger can be dealt with by the home supply.
Ok when dishwasher,washing m/c vacuum cleaner 2.3kw grinder ,MIG welder all in use at the same time possible problem but I guess car charging overnight however so would everybody else so district supply overloaded?
The question is-how long would it take to charge-so I think you would want the convenience of charging at home with top ups elsewhere.
My son has run both Renault Cloey & Nissan Leaf so we have some experience.

 

[GeoffB]

Pal of mine took the I Pace out the other week to try the range. Worked out route to recharge. First two stops charge points not working , managed to get a full charge. Rapid charge 40mins to 75%. On way home ended up running 240v plug from garage to slow charge to get home. Going to keep his 5.0 lt supercharge jag now,as he says at least can top up anywhere and quickly. Going on that takes no more than 5 mins to refill and pay and still que at pumps in peak time. So converting petrol stations to recharge at 40 mins at a time. How big are they going to get what you going to do when it's recharging. I dont think it's happening anytime soon,plus if your so worried about environment assume car is tuned for mileage and low emissions and the increase in performance must be a fortunate byproduct of the extreme economy mode. Me I'll use my turbo as much as possible and my diesel jag and diesel camper.
If you are all really worried please buy the electric car of your choice and leave the fossil fuels to us to enjoy []Happy motoring all